Do Poor PPV Numbers for UFC 106 Mean the UFC Is Running Out of Steam?
by Kid Nate on Dec 3, 2009 1:53 PM EST
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In his Wrestling Observer Newsletter (subscription only), Dave Meltzer is reporting disappointing pay per view estimates for UFC 106 -- he is currently projecting a final count for 106 of 360,000 to 375,000 compared to an expected 500,000 for UFC 104. The news here is that an event featuring two proven PPV draws in Tito Ortiz and Forrest Griffin was expected to outperform an event featuring Lyoto Machida and Shogun Rua.
Meltzer writes:
The 106 number is looking to be so much lower than even the most pessimistic expectations going in. My feeling is it’s a combination of the weak Countdown show, bad time slot of the Countdown show, and that 105 was pushed as a major event on Spike, was free, and a one week build for a PPV isn’t going to work unless you’ve got a match people wanted to see. Clearly, people both believed Ortiz was done and don’t care and the burials of him clearly hurt him, and Griffin did himself incredible harm with that performance against Anderson Silva and everyone saw that fight. I thought the Griffin like ability factor overcomes his losses, because he’s lost before and drawn big after. But his leaving the ring and it wasn’t losing a gutsy fight which Griffin can do forever and draw, but looking like he was completely out of his league against a great fighter, made people no longer see him as a PPV main event fighter. ... it’s the first time I’d go so far as to say the casual fan base rejected two big-name fighters in a main event position since this got on television in 2005.
If this is an overexposure issue, the most insidious thing historically about overexposure is that by the time the signs are apparent of the beginnings of a fall, it’s usually at the point where the momentum downward is already dangerous. But really, until we get a match with two stars with momentum, it’s hard to say exactly where we are. The Memphis show is a very good card when it comes to depth, but I don’t see Penn vs. Sanchez as a main event that would do good numbers. Jan. 2 is a disaster as a PPV event with so many matches falling through. The Super Bowl weekend show is also a good card that lack a big main event. Australia has the drawback of being in Australia so you won’t get a lot of U.S. mainstream coverage and it also doesn’t have that killer main event. We’re really not taking about a huge draw fighting until March with St. Pierre, and he’s got the issue that nobody in the world believes Dan Hardy can beat him and it’s too early to know what kind of back-up he’s going to have.
Zach Arnold sounded alarm bells earlier:
Overexposure is a big issue for the UFC. The public itself is not tired of UFC, but rather selective in which fights they want to pay for. Certainly, UFC 100 with Brock Lesnar and Georges St. Pierre did great PPV business. BJ Penn vs. Kenny Florian did great business, too, in Philadelphia. However, since mid-August, the company's business has significantly cooled down after reaching an apex last July. The big question regarding UFC 100 was whether or not it was a preview of how big the sport could get under Zuffa management or whether or not this truly was the mountain top. While the jury may still be out on that answer, the initial signs indicate that the 1.6 millionish PPV buys the company did for UFC 100 was more or less the company's zenith.
...
The catch 22 for UFC is that in order to expand, they have to run more shows in more markets. This has created a wave of television product that has not only taxed the viewers but taxed the company's employees as well. It takes a toll on the production staff and in many ways UFC is facing a similar problem to what WWE's production staff faces. Because they are so busy putting up and taking down equipment for shows that it becomes harder and harder to sit back and evaluate what exactly is going on and how to give everything a new face lift when you have a show to put on every 3 or 4 weeks. And ultimately the man responsible for micro-managing the production of UFC is Dana White.
...
There will always be injuries in the fight game. There will always be political battles between management and talent. However, the easiest way to minimize this problem is by not running as many shows. UFC finds itself in a position where they have to run a lot of shows in order to keep fighters busy, but it becomes a more difficult task to make new stars and be able to take some time and show some patience in the star-making process when you have to promote a show every three weeks. When most of your time is spent on the road and not at the office, that can be a real challenge.
UFC's gamble right now is expanding their schedule to run many international shows, shows that in the future it will pay off with big dividends. The problem with that strategy is that it requires talent that is healthy to fight and right now UFC is running out of warm bodies to make the strategy work.
They have reportedly canceled at least one show, per Jonathan Snowden:
It's carnage out there, but a short staffed UFC could have it much worse. Originally a show was scheduled for Dublin in January. That one was wisely cancelled, a prudent move for a promotion facing a talent crisis. But there was no real consideration given to combining UFC 108 and 109 to provide fans with a single card worthy of the UFC name.
Instead they will trot out Rashad Evans-Thiago Silva at UFC 108 and Randy Couture-Mark Coleman at UFC 109 and pretend they are real main events, instead of merely attractive feature bouts for the second from the top slot. If these shows flop, don't blame the matchmakers. It's the curse of Cain that caused the chaos.
In August during the heat of the Fedor bidding war, the UFC was full of hubris and was planning a hectic fall schedule counting on Brock Lesnar vs Shane Carwin, Rampage Jackson vs Rashad Evans, B.J. Penn vs Diego Sanchez, Cain Velasquez vs Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira, and Anderson Silva vs Vitor Belfort to headline a packed string of must see events. Unfortunately Penn vs Sanchez is the only fight that looks like it will happen in the near term.
The better part of valor would have probably been to cancel not just one event in Ireland but at least two events, maybe three. They've done a brilliant job of building the UFC brand and training fans to expect great fights at every UFC event. This has freed them from the traditional fight promoter's dependence on star attractions to some extent. But ultimately as Meltzer pointed out, cards must be headlined by stars in compelling fights. At this point, beyond UFC 107's lightweight title there is nothing on the horizon until the May Machida-Rua rematch that is a true must see fight.
Time will tell if the UFC has permanently stunted their momentum.
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[Comparatively] terrible cards yield terrible results. I’m not surprised at all. Nobody should care about Tito Ortiz so this might be a sign that public perception is heading in a more sensible direction and away from Pro Wrestling promotional antics. I’m tired of hearing about grudge matches and terrible fighters like Baroni gettings lots on UFC main cards while better guys are getting cut by the week.
by Ahhhoki on Dec 3, 2009 12:53 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Tito’s lost most, if not all of his drawing power in my eyes. And after A. Silva destroyed Forrest and he ran away afterwards, I don’t think anyone really wanted to see him main event a card either. IMO if there would’ve been a title fight, or at the very least, a title contender fight to main event, this would’ve sold way better.
by itsallgood013 on Dec 3, 2009 12:59 PM EST via mobile reply actions
A Silly Question
Do Poor PPV Numbers for UFC 106 Mean the UFC Is Running Out of Steam?
No. It means a lot of things, but it doesn’t mean that thing.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
by Brett Jones on Dec 3, 2009 12:59 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Yea its almost entirely based on banking on supposed name value alone for a card that had very little interesting action for the casual fan with only one week between cards.
Giving Shogun his props. I had the fight 48-47 Machida but Shogun put up a monumental performance and I am honored to have seen it in person.
don’t think they’re running out of steam as much as they’re simply trying to do so many shows in a short period of time. I don’t know the numbers but I think they’re making more if they can maintain decent cards and have more of them vs having half as many but being stacked mega cards. They have had some of the worst luck with injuries in this same period that they were hoping to ramp up their frequency of shows.
I think it’s a combination of things.
There is certainly an over saturation, but I think people overestimated Tito’s pull. Griffin’s performance against Silva hurt him a bit, and Tito hasn’t been around in forever.
To be perfectly honest, I’m a bit sick of the UFC events week in and week out. But what makes it more sickening is the quality of the fights. They’re terrible. Don’t get me wrong. Some of the fights I’m excited about, but most of them are absolute snoozers on my radar.
Combine that with the fact that the economy has probably caught up just a bit with the UFC and the fact that there are some indicators saying it’s going to actually get worse in 2010 doesn’t bode well. Will it kill off the UFC? No. They just need to slow down a little, let these guys get back to healthy.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Dec 3, 2009 1:03 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
The only reason for the doom & gloom talk is because 3 Title holders are unable to fight. Many people believe that if a title is not on the card, it is not legit.
That’s 4 title holders unable to fight actually.
by ufc4 on Dec 3, 2009 2:52 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It’s not oversaturation exactly. It’s the oversaturation of bad shows. That was the third PPV show in a row with an underwhelming lineup (Franklin v. Belfort as a main event?) It the cumulative effect of poor cards giving people the option of picking and choosing what to buy. And people getting out of the habit of buying every show is a dangerous downward slope. Ask the WWE.
by Jonathan Snowden on Dec 3, 2009 1:07 PM EST reply actions
Isn’t that what over saturation is?
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
We’ve had an oversaturation of poor shows – at least in the main draw/headliner category. UFC 103 until 109 (loved 103 and 104 but Machida/Rua was not a compelling draw for most casual fans at that time) have been bereft of compelling fights. Now instead of people jumping from Brock/Carwin to Rampage/Evans they get Tito/Grifffith and Rashard/Thiago, not really enough to keep you buying the third one. The UFC should really have dumped 108. Now they are faced with the possibility of fans burned out from uninteresting shows going elsewhere for their entertainment.
UFC is like spam...
Not the ham like meat, but the unwanted email. Maybe you sign up for an offers newsletter when you buy something online. Then you get an email every month with deals that might interest you. You check them out and every so often you find something you like and buy it. Then they come every week and you might check it out every month but the deals are fewer and farther between. And then it starts coming every day and you delete then and are annoyed with this spam sure the deals still exist, but you don’t have the time to dedicate to searching for them every day so you unsubscribe. The UFC is still profiting off of these lower buy rates, but it hurts the brand in the long run. I think they need something between PPV and FN to fill out the schedule.
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
This comment may disclose to much information about marketing at my company.
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
The UFC is still profiting off of these lower buy rates, but it hurts the brand in the long run.
A couple of things:
1. These lower buy rates are still pretty damn good buy rates. 330k is shockingly low for the UFC at this point, particularly with Tito and Forrest on top, but still, exactly what other PPV event is doing over 330k buys consistently?
2. Theoretically these shows that draw fewer buys would hurt the UFC over the long run. However, UFC 106 in particular was a very entertaining show. If it had been a dog of a show, that’d be one thing, but the 330k+ who saw it were almost certainly entertained. It stands to reason that the UFC won’t lose any of that show’s audience going forward.
3. As for the long run, we all sort of understand that even with Cain Velasquez’s brain wreaking havoc at the moment, these shows are atypical of the UFC product. They are not atypical in the recent past or in the recent future, but over the long run going backward and looking forward, they are little more than blips on the proverbial radar. Which is to say that I agree with your theory, but it’s unlikely to play out in reality.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
by Brett Jones on Dec 3, 2009 1:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
1. this is true, but with historic PPV numbers being that low and still being great its hard to compare to these numbers because overhead has also changed. More Pub, more fighter money, ect. so its hard so say they are happy with the numbers. Are they making money?, more then likely, but what is there CTO? how will it affect the brand? I will get to those.
2. As Snowden said, getting people out of the habit of buying every show is a dangerous game. Its not the people that see the show that are the problem. And one show like this won’t kill any momentum. But people cards becoming less of an event will lead to bad things and damage the brand.
3.They just need to get stars back on the cards. they have some top guys, but Brock really shattered the draw power ceiling that Tito used to have. Gone are the days of title fights every/most PPV. Maybe they need an intercontinental belt? Or maybe a hardcore belt where they fight in a cage?
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
by szucconi on Dec 3, 2009 2:00 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Or maybe a hardcore belt where they fight in a cage?
This is probably the best thing ever posted on this site.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
paging Mick Foley
We're just a million little gods causin' rain storms, turning every good thing to rust.
Not really. Oversaturation is just a glut of product on the market. I don’t think that is the issue. I think the issue is that the product they are selling is getting noticably worse, to the point the audience is figuring out they don’t need to buy. It’s not the number of shows, it’s the quality if the shows.
by Jonathan Snowden on Dec 3, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
Having a weak show, once a month would not be an issue. Its the number of shows that is watering down the talent pool even more after the injuries took there toll. Its really both. One wonders if they net more if they cut more fighters and kept the top half of the last two shows and put on one mega show. Certainly they gross more this way, but they also have more overhead.
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
I don’t. I don’t think you can discount oversaturation. Oversaturation comes into play even more when they are oversaturating us with bad cards.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Dec 3, 2009 1:48 PM EST up reply actions
I think it only comes into play on any significant level when bad cards are involved.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
If these were all solid shows, the kind we saw last year and through most of the Zuffa era, this wouldn’t be an issue. But with the talent spread thin between PPV and SPIKE and injuries, all of the sudden they are pawning off cards that aren’t worth $50. It took a couple of months, but the fans are catching on. It’s dangerous to let them get used to not buying every show….
by Jonathan Snowden on Dec 3, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
It speaks to the nature of this sport. That is to say that it’s still largely star driven with the actual athletic contest being secondary to the majority of the audience at large.
That’s not necessarily a bad thing, at least it’s not if you are working for the UFC. But it allows for circumstances like the one we’re addressing in this post.
I feel like a card such as UFC 106 will ultimately promote the sport on it’s athletic merits. Not to some great degree, but again, I can’t see how you can watch that event and not be entertained. Although, I was convinced that Tito and Forrest were good for a bare minimum of 500k buys, so my perception of things isn’t necessarily 100% accurate.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
Exactly. It is the nature of this sport.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Dec 3, 2009 2:04 PM EST up reply actions
We could have had this:
UFC 105
BJ Penn vs. Diego Sanchez
Randy Couture vs. Brandon Vera
Antônio Rogério Nogueira vs. Luiz Arthur Cane
Michael Bisping vs. Denis Kang
Dong Hyun Kim vs. Dan Hardy
UFC 106
Brock Lesnar vs. Shane Carwin
Tito Ortiz vs Forest Grifith
Kenny Florian vs. Clay Guida
Jon Fitch vs Ricardo Almeida
UFC 107
Georges St. Pierre vs. winner of Kampmann and Swick
Rampage Jackson vs. Rashard Evans
Frank Mir vs. Cheick Kongo
Thiago Alves vs. Paulo Thiago
Paul Buentello vs, Todd Duffee
UFC 108
Anderson Silva vs. Vitor Belfort
Antônio Rodrigo Nogueira vs. Cain Velasquez
Gabriel Gonzaga and Junior dos Santos
UFC 109
Lyoto Machida vs. Shogun Rua
Mark Coleman vs. Randy Couture
Matt Serra vs. Frank Trigg
Nate Marquardt vs Dan Henderson
I don’t think anyone would be complaining.
by John Nash on Dec 3, 2009 1:09 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Ahh
finally some levelheaded logic. Have a rec good sir.
The UFC hasn’t run out of momentum or reached any sort of zenith (that anyone would label 100 a zenith so soon afterwords is ridiculous), it’s run into unbelievably bad luck regarding injuries and last minute cold feet to headlining fighters.
It’s quite simple from my point of view.
Everybody should rec this post.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Dec 3, 2009 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
If the UFC had no injuries and contract problems would we be talking about how great they were building off 100? Probably. But as soon as these troubles starting popping up the UFC should have scaled back on some of the shows. Now they may be facing the opposite problem: people finding otherways to entertain themselves then watching a UFC event.
Also take note: If you are going to dog a fighter for 18 months that he’s overrated, a jerk, and stinks, it’s going to come back to bite you on the ass when you make him your headliner.
Time to bring in the lighter weights.
I think they could assist the talent problem by bringing in the featherweights and lighter weight classes. That would definitely make it more interesting for some.
Manny Pacquiao = 147 pounds (Most popular fighter on the planet right now)
Jose Aldo = 145 pounds
I think it would help…
You’re general thesis is correct, though the connection between Pacquiao and Aldo is a bit of a stretch.
Still, Zuffa just signed an extension with Versus, presumably through 2011, so don’t hold your breath on Aldo, Bowles, and the rest of the Feather and Bantamweights heading to the UFC any time before then.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
My thinking isn’t trying to compare Alda with Pacquio obviously, but refuting the WWE idea that only heavier weights sell.
The free TV is one angle, but the dilemma seems to be talent for the PPV. There should seem to be a way to integrate the two brands together and begin to capitalize on the great fights in the lower divisions.
More weight divisions = more title fights.
More weight divisions = more title fights.
Yes.
I know there are some who would decry the addition of weight classes to the UFC, citing boxing as making weight classes indistinguishable from one another.
The problem with boxing isn’t just that they have 16 weight classes (or 11 more than the UFC currently has), it’s that they have 16 weight classes and about 745,000 phony baloney sanctioning bodies, each with their own flavor of champion, and never the twain shall meet.
But that’s me getting off onto a bit of a tangent. My point is, I agree that the addition of two championship level weight classes to the world’s largest MMA brand would be a good thing and that only a fool would claim that the addition of a whole two weight classes would cause too much confusion.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
This is the automatic response to any sort of talent crisis in the UFC, isn’t it? It’s not happening.
Heavy.com -- Lead Staff Writer
Nor should it. More free MMA on Versus. Piss off with this merge talk.
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
How is more free MMA on Versus different from more free MMA on Spike?
The answer is that 20% (18 million subscribers) of the cable/sattelite/FiOS audience aren’t restricted from viewing the free fights on Spike.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
Piss off, I have versus and I don’t care what you do or don’t have.
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
But not in HD. Well, I can’t say that 100% since comcast is in the middle of the digital transition my channels are all mixed up
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
Do you even pay for the HD package? You have rabbit ears hooked up to your TV.
And seriously, if Comcast can’t provide Spike in HD in 2009 (soon to be 2010), then I can’t even take seriously an argument to keep fighting on a cable network owned by Comcast.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
Do you even pay for the HD package?
I have a crazy ass lcd tv that gets me most HD stuff within the basic package without paying extra. I am very cheap.
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
Ok, so for all you know Comcast actually offers Spike in HD if you pay for the HD package.
Can anyone confirm that Comcast offers Spike in HD? That would pretty much end the argument.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
Can anyone confirm that Comcast offers Spike in HD? That would pretty much end the argument.
They just finally added it in my area a few weeks ago. There was a long time that I had VS in HD but not Spike. It was ridiculous. They just added a ton of new HD channels though so I can’t complain now.
"I could be chasing an untamed ornithoid without cause."
Not happening now, but it’s a phenomenal idea. I don’t understand it, to be honest. Those weight classes sell themselves with how fucking ridiculous the fights are.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Dec 3, 2009 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
It makes no sense to me that Zuffa doesn’t want the UFC exposure for the feather and bantam weights. Heck, they should find some flyweights too.
And honestly, keep WEC going (And the"More" free MMA on TV). It’s great for the Rosholts, Rollers, Cerrones, Varners, etc. But not for the Aldos, Fabers, Browns, et al….
It’s a matter of securing enough of the most highly talented lightweights and building that division not at the expense of continuing to build both the Feather and Bantamweight divisions.
Of course, if this was being done under the UFC umbrella, it would be a non-issue, since the divisions and their champions gain automatic credibility by association.
Instead, a couple hundred thousand people watch WEC on Versus, most shows do less than 10k paid, and none of the fighters (with the possible exception of Urijah Faber) can make any headway toward increasing their earning potential.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
The fighters have all increased their earning promotion dramatically from where they were a year ago. The WEC provides 120 slots for lighter weight fighters. Many of the guys there would be back on the streets if the UFC cherry picked the top fighters….more on the WEC coming soon enough to a newsstand near you…
by Jonathan Snowden on Dec 3, 2009 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
That’s 100% true.
I’m sorry. What I meant to say was that they have no upward momentum within the WEC at this point. Urijah Faber is but one man, and his fights with Mike Brown haven’t helped Brown to become an sort of star in his own right (despite deserving it on merit). We’ll see if Aldo can capitalize on his place atop the division, but even with his amazing style, it will probably be a hard sell.
To be clear, I love the WEC. I just think that it serves everyone better if they are rolled into the UFC, which we’ve already seen happen with their other, less successful divisions. If they were making hand over fist and there wasn’t a pretty clear and already executed strategy for getting the fighters on the biggest stage the sport has to offer, then it wouldn’t even be a thought. It’s not like anyone is saying “Strikeforce must merge with the UFC!”
I mean, I suppose some people are saying that, but those people are crazy people.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
No way
This line of reasoning doesn’t make much sense to me. In the short term, it’ll help out with a couple main events maybe. But beyond that? If we think that the UFC is oversaturating their market with too many PPVs, adding two more weight classes just compounds the problem, because it would mean either
A) Putting on around 30% more PPVs
B) Cutting Significant Amounts of fighters from their other classes
C)Having each figher fight way less frequently
None of those are that palatable, and I think one of the strongest aspects of the UFC is that they only have 5 champs, so its easy for the casual to keep track of.
Not happening after the extension, which is bullshit.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Dec 3, 2009 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
People cant afford $50 shows every three weeks right now. Especially after being disappointed by underwhelming performances.
agreed
i was getting every ppv for about 2 yrs straight….then the cards became more disappointing than good. the frequency of the cards increased and my wallet could not catch up with my cable bill.
Yeah, those 108 and 109 main events …
… no help on the horizon after BJ and Diego.
Although detractors decry (MMA) as a brutal, bloody form of human cockfighting, aficionados know it is a brutal, bloody, totally fucking awesome form of human cockfighting. -The Onion
by The Kittitas Kid on Dec 3, 2009 1:15 PM EST reply actions
The only money cards of the year, meaning good headliners and elite fighters on them consistenly, are the super bowl and year end cards. Aside from that, it’s a crap shoot. Evans vs. Silva? Cote vs. Silva? Bisping vs. Leben? Child please. I hope my expectations aren’t high but I expect high calibur cards from the org with the most talented fighters. Not Bisping vs. Leben….at least as a main event.
and this year the New Years and Super Bowl cards
are among their weakest headliners of the year.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
Yes,
A massive swath of injuries would tend to cause a decrease in quality like this.
I’m not sure why you’re trying to make it into something it’s not.
time will tell my friend
I think they are making a huge mistake by putting on a string of very very weak headliners 102, 103, 105, 106, 108, 109 and 110 will all feature non-title headliners. They are training fans to not order every ppv.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
There are two sides to that coin.
They are either training fans not to order PPVs headlined by a non-title match, or they are training fans to understand that great matches occur without a title match headlining the show.
Over the short term, it’s the former. Theoretically it would change to the latter over the long term, but if you sacrifice too much of the audience outside of your base before you get to that long term, then I suppose you never meet the desired end.
I happen to think this is a particularly dire circumstance. It’s a roller coaster with both highs and lows. I suppose we’ll see if this is too long of a low period, but I find it hard to believe that folks won’t fork their cash over to watch Lesnar, GSP, and others fight, even after this stretch.
Twitter @brettcjones
"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard
We shall agree to disagree then, i think.
I see nothing on the horizon that presents any sort of threat to the UFC or MMA in general.
Surely a rough stretch is currently happening and will continue to do so for a few months possibly, but it nothing more than that. A rough stretch due to rotten luck and bad timing. No plateaus reached, and no spiraling declines.
So what are they supposed to do? If they cancelled those shows or put them on Spike then people still wouldn’t be paying for the PPV so either way fans aren’t ordering them. There’s nothing they can do about non-title headliners when 80% of their champs are hurt. They can either put on really good cards once every three months or keep going like they have been, let the casual fans save their money for a couple months, and then when GSP, Machida, Brock, and some of the other big names come back next spring they’ll be back into another growth cycle like they were with 101 and 101. I realize it’s not ideal but they can’t just cancel all their cards and tell the guys who aren’t huge names tough shit, you’re just gonna have to wait til everyone else gets healthy.
by ufc4 on Dec 3, 2009 6:44 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
After Brock went ill and it looked like everything was hitting the fan they could have cancelled 106.
You could have put Luiz Cane vs. Antonio Rogerio Nogueira back on 105 and added Amir-Baroni to 105 (he’s a recent TUF alumni) and put Josh Koscheck vs. Anthony Johnson on 107 and Tito Ortiz vs. Forrest Griffin on 108. Now you’re main cards are
105:
Amir Sadollah vs. Phil Baroni
Michael Bisping vs. Denis Kang
Luiz Cane vs. Antonio Rogerio Nogueira
Mike Swick vs. Dan Hardy
Randy Couture vs. Brandon Vera
107 (renamed 106)
B.J. Penn vs. Diego Sanchez
Frank Mir vs. Cheick Kongo
Jon Fitch vs. Mike Pierce
Josh Koscheck vs. Anthony Johnson
Kenny Florian vs. Clay Guida
108 (renamed 107)
Tito Ortiz vs. Forrest Griffin
Rashad Evans vs. Thiago Silva
Tyson Griffin vs. Jim Miller
Carlos Condit vs. Paul Daley
Junior Dos Santos vs. Gabriel Yvel
And tell you what 108 is still too weak so I’d cancel it, fold a couple of the fights into Fight Night and the rest into 109 with a great undercard show.
So 109 (renamed 107) would be
Mark Coleman vs. Randy Couture
Tito Ortiz vs. Forrest Griffin
Rashad Evans vs. Thiago Silva
Matt Serra vs. Frank Trigg
Junior Dos Santos vs. Cain Valesquez (Big Nog Can take on Carwin when they’re healthy)
Those are great cards.
Yea the novelty wears off when you show it all the time.
If you eat chocolate once in a while its a treat everyone wants. If you give it away everyday less and less people will want it especially if that chocolate gets bitter and worse tasting each time you give it away.
And don’t forget the chocalate merchandising deals and the new chocolate-branded gyms and all the douchebags that started wearing chocolate shirts. I’m already sick of the word chocolate.
The path to my fixed purpose is laid with iron rails, whereon my soul is grooved to run. Towards thee I roll, thou all-destroying but unconquering BROCKLESNAR; to the last I grapple with thee.
by judonerd on Dec 3, 2009 2:15 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Well, two weak main events in a row, where none of the fighters involved were either title holders or in line for a title shot with a win. As people have pointed out, UFC 108 isn’t perfect either (though I like it more than either UFC 105 or 106’s) and UFC 109’s is a joke, if it stands as it is. that’s a fight that I think there might be a lot of novelty interest in, but paying 50$ to watch THAT as your main event is crazy and a half. On network TV it’d probably do great numbers though
I think its just growing pains right now, combined with some extraordinarily bad injury luck.There’s still a limitation to the amount of MMA market right now. Hardcore fans are maybe also getting spoiled a bit. If you have Versus, Showtime and HDNET, and you can see a lot of fights for free, maybe you don’t have the same need to drop 50$ on fights anymore. Especially as seeing Tyron Woodley fight is probably more exciting than watching the UFC’s senior league at 109.
by TLow on Dec 3, 2009 1:20 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Look at boxing earlier this year
Oscar retired. Floyd was “retired.” Manny was out of the limelight until May. Calzaghe retired, Hopkins was out, Pavlik was hurt, Vazquez and Marquez were taking breaks, and so on.
Then fall rolled around, Floyd and Manny came up big, and now the biggest money boxing match ever is on the horizon.
UFC will come back around, too. They’ll take some hits in the short term, but if they play it right, they should come out of it with a couple legitimate new draws (Cain? Carwin? Vitor-Marquardt winner?) and a healthy slate of champions.
A big difference in perception here is boxing media vs. MMA media. The boxing media puts on pom-poms and cheerleads everything. MMA media is filled with Zach Arnold Chicken Little types. So all we’re going to hear about for the next several months is how things are falling apart for the UFC, when really they’re just hitting the sort of stretch promoters of all sorts hit from time to time.
by andherewego on Dec 3, 2009 1:21 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Then fall rolled around, Floyd and Manny came up big, and now the biggest money boxing match ever is on the horizon.
Very surprised this wasn’t mentioned in write up. I think this has swung the casual fan’s attention back to boxing (momentarily) when talking combat sports.
we're working on a follow up
only so much info you can cram into a blog post
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
That was more a function of fanatical and delusional mma fans UFC disciples kowtowing D.W.‘s and the misguided anti-boxing talking points in general that boxing was dying. People that know anything about boxing (and not just what someone else who’s job it is to sell their product over it), knew that it was far from being in the dire straits some hoped it was.
Personally, I’d rather see the UFC only do one PPV a month.
I think they have been doing them too often and unless a big name cycles through a given PPV, the fight cards are not as exciting. If they slowed down just a bit and did them once a month, the same saturday of the month each time or something, I think it would get a better chance to grow into something people look forward to month after month. But when they pop up every week or two, it’s too much. People have lives, have better thing to spend fifty bucks on twice a month.
"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't." - Jack Dempsey
Speaking for myself, going into the card my bucket was pretty full. 2 weeks earlier I caught a great strikeforce card for free, and then a week later I saw another pretty good card with a not great main event for free. If Machida or Anderson or Lesnar/Carwin, or GSP were fighting I’d have bought it, but there was none of that. I was excited for Forrest and Tito, but mostly just excited to catch it on the interweb afterwards. If it were free I’d have watched it, but coming off of consecutive free cards just didn’t do much for me.
by Dooda on Dec 3, 2009 1:23 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
This card just wasnt that good on paper, end of.
But I think teh UFC need to calm down.
Over-saturation.
They need to chill with all these shows. 1 show a month period would be fine with me. But nooooooo they need $$$$$$!!!!
I like the feeling of not having seen UFC for a while. Makes it feel bigtime! I don’t even watch Unleashed shows anymore, they’re on ALL the time. So are the Ultimate Knockouts and Fight Night replays. Its too much.
Mauricio Shogun Rua #1 LHW in the World. The TRUE Champion.
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."
All it is
is that the Champions have injuries or whatever and there is a lot of time off between their fights.
Add WEC and you have two new champions.
Cash Flow
will determine when the UFC is truly slowing down, as with all businesses. I view Dana White as essentially a small business owner, one who knows and loves his product, but whose optimism and enthusiasm leads to overextending resources on infinite expansion plans before the core business can sustain the investments required to expand. The Fertittas have experience running more than just a small business and Zuffa’s financing isn’t solely coming from excess cash flow, however this is exactly when over expansion is most dangerous; when owners decide to borrow against projected future profits because financing is cheap based on core business returns.
Taxing resources isn’t only an issue with cash, but as pointed out production staff, support staff, and contract fighters as well. Zuffa needs to find the right balance of shows so as not to create what is referred to as “the cannibal effect” where one product line is actually taking away from an other product line and the result is lower overall sales. Zuffa needs to identify what level of positive margins are not worth chasing given their resources. Even a 350,000 show with a low-end promotion budget should net Zuffa at least $3-4 million in net income. The question is does making that $3-4 million cost the next event more or less? Also putting on a free event after a 2-3 week span of no shows 1st and a PPV the next weekend is poor planning. Let the PPV go first, it will only increase the viewers for the free show, putting the free show first takes buys away from the PPV.
Just some simple business principles about expanding need to be remembered and Zuffa will be just fine. MMA won’t be the most popular sport in the world in 5 years as Dana likes to say, but maybe it is in 20 years. Business expansion rates are never sustainable when growth is exponential instead of geometric. Sounds like its time to go back to a slow and stead growth model, not pump out as much product as possible because its flying off the shelf mode.
Normally I wouldn’t think over expansion could kill Zuffa, but due recent news of large dividends being paid to the owners and a debt load closer to $500 million than $250 million if Zuffa gets in a cash pinch the credit markets will be difficult to tap into, especially with the general tightness of the credit market. The next 12-months should be very interesting business-wise for Zuffa. Their chance of failing isn’t high, but its certainly higher than it was say 2 years ago. Time will tell.
Nice post.
The other thing is that Zuffa is an event driven company, meaning that a lot of their value is determined by how consistently well they do per event and what their average cash flow is for these events. Meaning if they want to be upgraded, having more shows perform at a consistent basis is what they are trying to do to grow. Though, like many have said, they could be over saturating the market, specially if their product is a PPV event driven one.
Tito has been out for so long and not done anything relevant in a while, which doesn’t make dropping $45 bucks seem appealing. Forrest has been tainted by his KO losses, so it makes sense that there were poor buy rates.
In fact, 300,000 seems good for such a poor card. The numbers are due to the card, not the UFC as a whole.
Now is the winter of our discontent.
Wait 6 months for everyone to be healthy.
Keep firing Assholes!
In Idaho, it's illegal to f--- a porcupine. You know why? Because someone tried it.
by Ubernoober on Dec 3, 2009 1:46 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Ha ha, you have foresight, you must be old!
by casey manrique on Dec 3, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
A fighter's union might actually benefit the UFC
A fighter’s union might not look like such poison to the UFC at this point. A union actually protects both parties to some extent. While it wouldn’t prevent sickness, it could put tremendous internal pressure on fighters to keep the bigger cause at heart.
While the UFC would give up some profits up front, it would be mitigating the effect of individual actions over the long term.
I was trying to figure out how this show compares to other numbered UFC events where the fighters in the headliner were both coming in off losses… It’s pretty rare and I could only find two:
102 (Couture/Nogueira) – 435k buys
99 (Franklin/Wanderlei) – 360k buys
If anyone else can think of any other examples, it’d be interesting to see if they’re in the same ballpark. One thing of note is that those 4 fighters from 99 and 102 were all coming in following a loss, but had won their fight prior to that. By contrast, Tito came in 0-2-1 in his last 3 fights and Griffin came in on a two fight losing streak.
I personally would like to see the UFC concentrate on quality rather than quantity. I would like to see the UFC only do at most one show a month, instead of having the large UFC events, with a bunch of UFNs thrown in there. I think the UFC should focus more on making these cards more like events, rather than just another show. It used to be that I would talk about how a great UFC event was happening. Now when me and my friends talk about it, it’s more like, “There’s another UFC on this weekend. Wanna go to the bar after work to see it?” There’s no genuine excitement and thrill unless there is a fight that I absolutely have to see. Instead of looking forward to one big fight a card, it woul be nice to look forward to the whole main card itself.
I love me some Sexyama!
Bad timing x 2?
This is a personal observation, but I think the UFC has suffered from a rash of injuries to their top draws, and has subsequently had much weaker cards at the worst time.
Throughout the fall, the UFC has to compete with college football, and to a lesser degree the NFL. UFC PPVs are going up against college football games on TV, and people are also spending their Sat. nights at tailgates or post game parties across college campuses. When you add to that lack of major headliners like Lesnar, GSP, Rampage, etc, you exacerbate the low buy rate issue.
Once January hits, those problems go away, and at least in my circle, attention goes back to focusing much more on the UFC.
Oh great...
…more Chicken Little bs.
THE UFC WILL BE DEAD IN 12 MONTHS!!!!!!
There is a bit of irony in people who go to an MMA news site every day and post in comment threads talking about the sport stating that there is too much of it on.
UFC has done poorly because most of their main events have fallen apart. 2 years ago, they were thrilled to be getting 300k buys….just because they had the biggest event ever in July doesn’t mean that they’ll do that every month.
I think most knowledgeable fans would trade quantity for quality when it comes to PPVs. That’s what this is about. The UFC was thinning out the cards before the rash of injuries and they were counting on the majority of fans to remain ignorant to what a PPV quality card entails.
The fact is, the UFC could have combined some shows once all the injuries hit but they weren’t going to do that because they could still make money even with weak cards. But even TUF noobs eventually become more educated and “selective”. I think the UFC needs to do fewer PPVs and more free Spike cards. They can save all their big-name talent forstacked PPVs every 2/3 months and give their other guys work on free TV every month to keep them active.
"It would appear that the strain was more than he could bear".- Doc Holliday
The Sport of MMA, not the UFC
Sorry for the long post…but
I’ve been saying for years that the UFC aint what it used to be. And its been 2 years since I’ve ordered a UFC ppv with the exception of UFC100.
THEN – Up until around UFC 60 something, their cards used to be decent to great, top to bottom with maybe 2 fights on the card that you didn’t care much about.
NOW – UFC cards have 1 maybe 2 vet fights that look decent ahead of time, and the rest full of TUF rookies who you cant care much about because they’re rookies.
This is what greed and panic does, not to mention ‘cheating the fans’.
The UFC failing to acknowledge other promotions as legitimate just makes them look like ‘silly bullying idiots who are losing their grasp’ at this point. Other promotions are surpassing them with TV deals, more consistency in the quality of their fight cards, and are building their rosters with more known and better, more entertaining fighters than ‘TUF’ rookies.
Strikeforce is awesome and growing and getting better and better while the UFC gets more watered down with dolls and bball cards and games.. greed.
You also dont see Strikeforce or any other promotions introducing jack-asses like Junie Brown-stain and War Dildo who do damage to the sport like the UFC does. Herschel Walker maybe old but he’s a tremendous athlete who wont tarnish the sport by acting like an ass. I’ll watch him. I’ll never watch them.
Its just painfully obvious that the UFC cares only about ratings and money but not about the sport of MMA or about the fans as Dana ‘Don King’ White constantly states he does.
One has to be responsible for their words and actions at some point.
I’m also getting tired of hearing Joe Rogan scream things that aren’t happening in fights to sensationalize the boredom of them. Just call it for what it is and stop ‘selling it to us by yelling it to us’. The UFC has just become too circus’y of a spectacle and has become less about the fighting sport of MMA. They could get back to the sport by doing the following.
Have less quantity and more quality events. Too many events water down cards and cheat fans.
Cut Kimbo and let him gain ground experience in another org before letting him fight in the UFC. Having him in his current green state diminishes the alleged talent level of the UFC.
Stop bring people into the sport who set it back and absolutely tarnish mma, like the two idiots I’ve already mentioned who dont deserve to have their name mentioned ever again.
Acknowledge other promotions and stop pretending that you are the only good promotion, again cheating the fans out of the best fights for their own selfish business greed.
Co-promote fights to see who truly IS the best in their weight division and to see who truly has the best fighters in ‘the sport’ of mma. Stop being afraid to have your fighters beat by another orgs.
Be about the sport rather than the revenue.
Until then, I wont order UFCs – there’s enough good free MMA on tv now and bit torrents have the ufc’s free just a few hours later. Why gamble and lose $50? More often than not, you’ll lose it on mediocre and over-hyped wwe cards with 1 decent fight.
Not once have I said “that ufc card was worth 60 bux!!!” Never.
The sport of MMA not the UFC
jiMMAy
by jiMMAy on Dec 3, 2009 3:13 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I wonder if other sports have this type of thing….“UGH NFL USED TO BE GOOD, SUCKS NOW, ARENA FOOTBALL IS WAY BETTER!”
You seem to be living in an altered perception…UFC has always been up and down, and there are more quality fights there now than ever. Sure UFC 47 was awesome, but then you get cards like Ortiz-Cote a few months later.
I’m happy to see more MMA, so Strikeforce putting on events is cool, but you have to be seriously deluded to think that they’re putting on better fights than UFC. It’s an org that has a top 10 WW fighting at MW because they’re so light on talent.
And co-promoting? Most ridiculous thing ever, and it’s amazing to me that Coker agreed to it…although he seems to be kind of a pushover and has been getting bullied around a lot. How does bringing 1 fighter and absolutely nothing else entitle you to 50% of the event itself? Is every fighters management team a “co-promoter” now? UFC co-promoting would benefit them 0%
Hate MMA? Hate the UFC's bs maybe.
Fedor V Brock or Nog, Randy… Overeem V Brock, Nog, Randy, etc.
King Mo and many potentials great fights.
Tyrone Woodley and King Mo Lawal who are both young with not much experience. Either would smash most TUF guys their size.
These are dumb ideas? Hardly. For real MMA fans and not just UFC fans..the best fights await in cross promotion.
But when the UFC fighter lost to a Strikeforce fighter – they’d look stupid & they’d never risk it. Why.. oh because they’re "for the sport and the fans’ Hell no. Its so you dont see the little man behind the curtain and that there is no powerful and mighty Oz.
Oh Sure… lets all hope the UFC continues creating mediocre ‘trilogies’ every few months, further fleecing the fans…because of some poor judging “controversy” rather than an actual draw in the fight. They take up room on many cards with this crap. Not all trilogies are worth watching.
The UFC’s early hype used to come from their fights and reputation… now they’re fights are second to the Hype which is puposely manufactured.
Keep throwing your money away on hype. Hype is not content. Hype is not a good fight.
Its total BS.
jiMMAy
UFC co-promoting would benefit them 0%
So you want to work for the UFC? You dont sound like a fan. Who gives a shit what’s good for Dana and Zuffa? Why do you care? Why, as a fan, wouldn’t you want to see everyone fighting everyone?
How will the best ever be determined with these ‘clubs’ refusing to cross promote?
Sports are for the fans. Otherwise were just watching business plans being carried out hoping we get thrown a good fight out of it.
MMA is still young and these are changes that need to be made.
jiMMAy
Sport for the fans, money for the business. No money, no business, no sport.
Welcome to the Machida Error.
by slapjaw ackrite on Dec 3, 2009 11:51 PM EST up reply actions
I think the UFC has run out of steam in the sense that their rate of growth has slowed sharply, and they may even have to shrink their operations for a time.
Early on during the TUF boom fans tuned in to watch UFC. Now those same fans are tuning in to watch specific fighters, and not just the UFC brand.
The sky is falling stuff is so goofy, shocked to see Dave falling for it. Rough November-February, then they’ll have a huge spring and summer.
Hilarious some of the writing going on. You might not know that 2009 was an all time record year for any sport on PPV ever. They took some injury hits, and overloaded their amount of shows so that the injuries hurt them. WHen Brock returns and Rampage fights Rashad next year, and both shows break a million buys, all of this nonsense will go away.
by Michael Rome on Dec 3, 2009 4:04 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
No one is saying that mega fights like Rashad-Rampage won’t sell. It will. So will Brock. The question is whether the stuff in between will continue to sell to the masses. So, you’re kind of talking around the point being made here. Dave has seen the wrestling business go from on fire to seeing fans buying Wrestlemania-and that’s it. You can’t conceive of that in MMA’s future as they do their level best to show fans that their events aren’t worth paying for?
by Jonathan Snowden on Dec 3, 2009 4:54 PM EST up reply actions
The difference is WWE PPVs offer no matches that haven’t been done on TV or on the previous PPV, and because it’s not a sport there’s no real incentive to buy the PPV instead of downloading it the next day or waiting three weeks for the DVD.
The oversaturation point some are making is stupid as they’re pretty much running the same number of fights in 2009 as they were in 2006. Jon’s point earlier about oversaturation of average cards is the real issue. Remember a few years ago when Dana said he didn’t think it was right to do a PPV without a title fight? The injuries aren’t their fault of course but from 102 to 110 there’s going to be two title fights over eight PPVs.
They paid for UFC 104, a show much weaker than shows like UFC 82, and shows like that did far worse numbers. And European shows have shown improvement, not decline in the last year.
It’s a sport, as you point out all the time, it’s not pro wrestling. As it becomes more and more of a sport, fans are going to reject irrelevant fights. The UFC’s job is to provide relevant fights. They haven’t done so at the end of this year, mostly due to injuries. They’ve taken a bad momentum hit, but they’ll be fine. Dave’s obsession with pro wrestling skews his analysis, this week he was talking about how this would prove if Dana is more like Bischoff or McMahon, as if those are the 2 most relevant sports figures to make comparisons to.
You’re shocked Dave fell for it? Really?
He’s fallen for some ridiculous shit in the past as well. Everyone probably does at some point.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Dec 3, 2009 5:02 PM EST up reply actions
Hmm...
In the isolated incident of 104 solidly outdrawing 106, I wonder if the “casuals” are becoming more in tune to what’s truly relevant in the sport? Obviously the fact that a title was on the line brought in buys, but the headliners were still two fighters relatively new to the American scene. I think before too long they won’t be considered “casuals” anymore.
This discrepancy can also be attributed to oversaturation, as thoroughly discussed above.
We're just a million little gods causin' rain storms, turning every good thing to rust.
I also think the other factors mentioned hurt UFC 106:
-Bad Countdown show slot, shorter than normal. The show didn’t get people the standard build up.
-the sine off of Forrest and Tito. Forrest’s bad loss in August, and Tito being gone for a while, and not winning in forever hurt their drawing power. Kos and Johnson were not draws as the co-main event. Tough spot
Are you nuts?
So one PPV that had tons of problems and a weak main event still sells over 350k buys and that means the UFC is running out of steam?
Man some people are retarded.
Forget Brock/Carwin was fucked, you lost Karo on this card, you had a co main event turn into a main event, Forrest coming off a loss, Tito not fighting for over a year and then coming back, a week after a free UFC card, a weak countdown show, etc.
And it still did 350k buys, and suddenly people think the UFC is done now?
Jesus. WHen the UFC gets healthy and titles begin to flow again, this isnt a problem, I dont get why people get all stupid, its not too much mma, it was a weak card with a weak main event.
Plus people have to remember this was a week after the big boxing event, so alot of people over a mill spent 60 bucks on that, so some might not have wanted to buy another PPV, the same month, and since the UFC was a weak card, that might have something to do with it.
People read into shit way too much.
Dec is a good card, Jan is weak with a weak main eevnt, but injuries happen, Feb could be a great card but I dont know if Vitor/Nate and Randy/Coleman are big PPV draws.
110 is overseas it wont be a huge selling PPV. Once the titles come back, March, April, May, June, with GSP, Spider, Machida/Shogun, Brock/Carwin, then it will be back to big selling PPV.
People get all crazy way too fast, that a PPV headlined by Forrest who looked awful in his last fight, vs Tito who has been out for over a year and a half, a card that lost fights, was a week after a free UFC event and a big boxing event, still sells 350k buys and people act like the UFC is gonna fall apart.
The funny thing about this is that instead of focusing on how great the buyrate was for UFC 104 500k, the focus is on how lower than expected buyrate for UFC 106 350k was.
If anything the UFC should be praised for getting casuals to buy a ppv headlined by 2 brazilians and making them draws, not only that but if the promote it right the rematch can do huge numbers.
The only thing UFC 106 proved is that Tito is done as a draw from now on, expect him to headline the next free UFC ppv on Spike. Forrest on the other hand got a big win and can move on to gettin back his status with the casuals.
All of this talk about the sky falling is of course ridiculous, when 350k ppv buys is bad news it just shows the strenght and roll that the UFC has been on for the past few year.
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