Rudy Valentino Accuses Georges St. Pierre of Steroid Use
by Monday Morning Martial Artist on Dec 22, 2009 10:25 AM EST
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This Fan Post was promoted to the front page by Nick Thomas. BJ Penn's trainer Rudy Valentino was a guest on SI's Gross Pointe Blank podcast and basically accused GSP of steroid use around the time of GSP/Penn II. This is what he had to say when discussing Penn possibly moving up:
"I think it's because of his so-called steroid use, and all of that, that B.J. felt it was an unfair fight. Just the whole thing about not being fair, and fighting fair, you know. That's what B.J. wants to get off of his back; The greasing stuff, the steroids, and all of that".
"We heard from certain people that used to train with him, telling us what he did in the past. That's why, we had a heads up on that. When you cycle steroids, you're not going to test positive. You can cycle it right up to the time of the fight and not test positive on that. That's what we suspected he did in this fight".
The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Bloody Elbow readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bloody Elbow editors or staff.
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Mayweather Sr. said
Pacquiao does it too.. Damn those top athletes..
I am. I think. I will. - Ayn Rand
And you believe him?
I’m 5.6" and half, roughly the same height as Pacman, and I weight around 141 with 9% body fat. I honestly believe a top caliber athlete like Manny can gain that much muscle mass without using steroids.
Skadoosh!
And HOW many times has Manny tested negative?
It’s a bunch, right? It’s not like the guy is ducking tests. I’d have to think if he was truly using, it would show up eventually.
"The moment you stop thinking you're the best, it's time for you to get out the game." -'King' Mo Lawal
i’m a Penn fan, but making accusations without proof is cheap. sure, we saw him grease, we cant say if GSP did it on purpose or not, but it did happen, theres video. did he use steroids? there’s no proof, so it shouldnt even be a topic of conversation.
I'm old school hating Lesnar, I've been hating Lesnar since '08
by MicahW on Dec 21, 2009 4:15 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I don’t remember seeing GSP grease, I remember seeing someone put grease on him.
The only thing Jon Jones does better than Matt Hamill is hear.
(And smash faces)
by ufc4 on Dec 21, 2009 5:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He needs help getting it into those hard to reach places.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
Are they ever gonna give this up?
Talk about beating a dead horse; they’ve buried it, set the grave on fire, dug up the body, chopped it up, buried it again, dug it back up, beat it some more, and buried it again. Looks like Rudy is looking for the shovel again …
by bigern on Dec 21, 2009 4:16 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
I've always thought he MIGHT be taking steroids too...
All the classic physical signs of steroid use are easily found on GSP, although much less now that years past.
"All the classic physical signs of steroid use are easily found on GSP"
Such as?
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
Rickson Gracie
Beating BJ Penn obviously.
Guillotine.
by iiowyn on Dec 21, 2009 4:33 PM EST up reply actions 13 recs
ZING!
if you are under 220 lbs, and beat BJ Penn, then you might be on steroids
Even a broken clock is right two times a day.
by Chris Toffer on Dec 22, 2009 9:27 AM EST up reply actions
He has muscles!
“Classic” signs of steroid use:
Red or purpleish acne: Nope, GSP has very nice skin (insert vaseline joke here)
Swelled skin filled with water: nope
Rapid muscle/size growth: nope
The only sign of steroid use GSP has is he is muscular. Which 90% of fighters are. Unless you have personal health things like his blood pressure, or size of testes, all of these claims are baseless.
What about his rapidly receding hairline and angrily beating women all the time?
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 21, 2009 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Did you just call BJ a woman?
Guillotine.
by iiowyn on Dec 21, 2009 7:32 PM EST up reply actions 11 recs
BJ has a rapidly receding hairline and just made diego his bitch….BJ PENN IS ON STEROIDS NOW TOO!!!! DEY TOOK ER JERBS!!!!!
by CliChe Guevara on Dec 21, 2009 7:47 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
nono
BJ Penn is just BJ Penn, but I can understand the mistake cliche
Even a broken clock is right two times a day.
by Chris Toffer on Dec 22, 2009 9:28 AM EST up reply actions
Of course it was steroids that beat up and crushed BJ’s soul making him quit, had nothing to do with GSP simply being better in every single way then Penn not at all.
Gsp is not better in every way than Penn, in fact I’ll go as far as to say the only things gsp are better than Penn at is wrestling/GNP, which albeit is enough to win the fight. Penn has better Jits and standup by far.
by kanodogg on Dec 22, 2009 11:31 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
GSP outstruck him easily in their fight, and has far more diverse standup. GSP’s top game is also incredible, and cut through Penn’s guard time and again.
by Hardcharger on Dec 22, 2009 11:52 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You forgot about conditioning, strength, gameplanning, and just overall surrounding himself with the right people (which it looks like BJ is trying to change.)
Really it’s a tradeoff. BJ has better boxing and Jitz, but GSP’s standeup is easily as good in other areas other than boxing. But if BJ’s jitz was anywhere close to GSP’s wrestling then it would be a wash and GSP wouldn’t take him down etc. Of course that wasn’t the case and BJ’s jits was no match for GSP’s wrestling.
Well I mean you can't blame GSP
He had to compensate for everyone on BJ’s team being on quaaludes somehow.
More pathetic whining from Team Yes Men.
They’ll try to do stuff like this, create a buzz, discredit GSP so that Penn’s ego can survive, and hopefully will get a 3rd shot at GSP without earning it. Penn doesn’t want to fight Alves/Fitch/Kos to earn a shot, he wants to talk his way into it.
by Hardcharger on Dec 21, 2009 5:11 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Exactly. Honestly, every time I start to get a little respect for the guy him or his camp come off with this crap. Dear BJ: YOU LOST, GET OVER IT.
by Jason H. on Dec 22, 2009 2:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m more interested in what BJ’s mother has to say about this.
The only thing Jon Jones does better than Matt Hamill is hear.
(And smash faces)
by ufc4 on Dec 21, 2009 5:19 PM EST reply actions 9 recs
I lawl’d.
Although detractors decry (MMA) as a brutal, bloody form of human cockfighting, aficionados know it is a brutal, bloody, totally fucking awesome form of human cockfighting. -The Onion
by The Kittitas Kid on Dec 21, 2009 5:25 PM EST up reply actions
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 21, 2009 6:15 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
Groin therapy.
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 21, 2009 7:36 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Hit them with your groin Georges.
Not that I condone facism or any ism for that matter. Isms are in my opinion, not good. A person shouldn't believe in an ism, he should believe in himself.
I quote John Lennon, "I don't believe in Beatles, I just believe in me". Good point there, after all he was the walrus. I could be the walrus. Wouldn't change the fact I have to bum rides off of people.
by Sam Cupitt on Dec 21, 2009 9:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Damn is GSP lucky or what. Does he have a GF? Or does he just sleep with different chicks every night?
for all intents and purposes, just consider all my posts as works of satire.
What kind of girl would date a guy on steroids? Poor guy has to sleep with a different group of four women every night.
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 22, 2009 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
Haha
I saw this picture coming from a mile away. Zing.
Why? BJ. Why?
BJ has built up so much goodwill and positive feedback from MMA fans after beating Florian and Sanchez. I know that he wants his shot at GSP, but why stoop to this level especially since he is more than talented enough to just fight his way to GSP. I’d bet the UFC would have Penn vs GSP 3 if BJ beat a Fitch, Koscheck, or Alves; just one fight at Welterweight. If GSP beats Hardy, then I can see a Penn vs GSP 3 superfight just because there won’t have any real contenders for both.
if he FINISHES
Fitch, he deserves an immediate shot. imho
For sure
Like I said, instead of antics like this and accusing GSP of whatever, BJ should just fight one of the top Welterweights and EARN his Title Shot. It will be good for him because he can get acclimated to fighting at Welterweight and hopefully with his new strength and conditioning program, he can gain the weight the right way. While any of the top Welterweights are some very tough challenges, BJ is definitely capable of beating them.
He obviously feels he’s somehow entitled to any and all title shots – that he won’t have to earn them like, dunno, every other fighter.
by Monday Morning Martial Artist on Dec 22, 2009 6:37 AM EST up reply actions
he’s a dominant champion, gsp would get Anderson right away etc
by cagefightonacid on Dec 22, 2009 12:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
GSP hasn’t lost to Anderson twice already.
by ufc4 on Dec 22, 2009 10:36 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
There are those who would argue that GSP and BJ are 1-1.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
I would. ish
I’d argue the first bout was a draw scoring wise (but a win for BJ real fight wise)
The second fight I’d call a NC due to Candian Shenanigans.
So I’d really call the trilogy at 0-0-1-1 for each fighter. one draw one NC (yes I said trilogy, fore it WILL happen get over it people nobody is gonna beat BJ under MW but St Pierre)
Even a broken clock is right two times a day.
by Chris Toffer on Dec 23, 2009 10:38 AM EST up reply actions
BJ would probably rather work for the immediate shot, because if not, he’ll have to fight through the WW division, which means at least one more fight at LW, then two at WW. That’s at least a year or so of serious training before getting a shot at GSP. By then, GSP would have probably gone to MW. I think BJ knows his time is limited on this one.
I love me some Sexyama!
Fitch grinds him into meat
just like he does everyone else.
like he did against Pierce?
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
BJ would beat Fitch by RNC
after pounding his face into dogmeat
by SteelerStuckintheSouth on Dec 28, 2009 4:00 PM EST up reply actions
He cannot be juicing...
Here’s why. Steroids have the nasty side effect of testicular shrinkage (not penile, which is the common misconception). GSP has to have large nuts, because so many people hug them simultaneously.
Case closed.
I can die happy now that I've been to a UFC event. 107 rocked
by slapjaw ackrite on Dec 21, 2009 9:09 PM EST reply actions 5 recs
Damnit.
I’m trying to spend a few months actually being a fan of BJ Penn for his hard work and dedication outside of the cage. Can’t he just make sure that neither he nor his crew says something aloud during this period?
I specializes in grammar fail.
dont chastize the champ for what Rudy says. If everyone was guilty by association, I’d be a black homophobic homosexual who hates black people.
Even a broken clock is right two times a day.
by Chris Toffer on Dec 22, 2009 9:33 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Honestly...
Georges St. Pierre will get randomly tested at some point… and then we can truly find out if he’s cycling or not. It wouldn’t surprise me if he was or he wasn’t, but it’ll happen sooner or later.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
i agree with this completely...
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Are you serious?, anyother baseless claims you want to give credence to while your at it?. How about GSP is a tax cheat or GSP is racist, because you know if people are accused of doing something from someone with a grudge it’s 50/50 if it’s true or not smfh.
I’m sorry, what baseless claim did he give credence to? I must have missed that part.
by ufc4 on Dec 22, 2009 10:39 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
You smell funny. And your username and twitter name are spelled differently which is confusing.
Grrrr,
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
Long story short: Knite is my PSN name and Knight is what I wanted it to be. I’m an idiot. I should have made all of them Knite.
Twitter: @FlyByKnite
by FlyByKnight on Dec 22, 2009 10:56 AM EST up reply actions
You didn't respond to my most serious accusation.
Grrrr.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
I haven’t showered this morning. I’m about to before I head out to IHOP.
Twitter: @FlyByKnite
by FlyByKnight on Dec 22, 2009 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
Well, I certainly feel like I told you.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
I trust Rudy because he has a mustache that says I could be a South American dictator if I wanted to.
by The Darkness on Dec 22, 2009 11:13 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
His mustache would also qualify him as a MMA ref. See: Mazzagatti, Steve.
by Monday Morning Martial Artist on Dec 22, 2009 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
You guys are all dumb as **** if you think there is zero percent chance that gsp or for that matter any mma fighter that has not used steroids. Did Tim Silvia show any signs of roiding? Did Sean sherk show any signs of roiding? I’ll bet if shamrock or kimo had said this about Royce Gracie back in the day, he’d be getting the same defense as gsp(disregard the fact that there’s probably a good chance both those guys were juicing at that time too), yet Royce has tested positive for the gummy bear juice, which granted was
at the tail end of his career, but who’s to say that he wasn’t doing them all along.
by kanodogg on Dec 22, 2009 11:26 AM EST via mobile reply actions
so if someone is caught doing steroids, that means all of them are doing steroids… what time is that ignorance 101 class you take?
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
You moran I’m not saying everyone is doing them, I’m saying that just because someone doesn’t get caught does not mean that they are clean. Stop being so naive.
by kanodogg on Dec 22, 2009 11:38 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yeah get a brain!
Baseless allegations are just that BASELESS, unless he has some sort of evidence you start getting into the realm of slander.
by ChillMike on Dec 22, 2009 11:47 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
In this case, a moran is actually genious. It is like the episode of the Office where they read Michael Scott’s script about Agent Micheal Scarn. In the story, Dwight reads for the character “Samuel L. Chang” but clearly Michael did a find / replace because there was left one “Dwigt.” The find / replace won’t find a misspelling. Here, kanodogg is slipping one past the comment police, no one will look for a “Moran.” Genious. Also, ChillMike, that is an awesome picture.
well, here we can flag comments, so it’s not really up to the comment police. But I think I’ve found the definition for a moran!
mor·an [ máwrən ] (plural mor·an)
noun
Definition:
East Africa Masai warrior: a young unmarried male warrior of the Masai people[Late 19th century. < Masai]
I take it back kanadogg, I didn’t know you were calling me a warrior! (sarcasm)
:P
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
by Orcus on Dec 22, 2009 12:44 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
ZOMG
That’s pretty awesome.
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 22, 2009 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
i’ll keep that in mind, wasn’t my intention of insulting you btw, like i said all tongue in cheek, ever since i first saw that “get a brain usa” pic years ago on fark i use “moran” as frequently as i can.
change of tone
sooooomeone got warned from a mooooooood
Even a broken clock is right two times a day.
by Chris Toffer on Dec 22, 2009 11:43 PM EST up reply actions
I knew you were a warrior when I saw you trying to argue politics with a dufus the other day…Morans unite against the morons :)
by Kwisatz Haderach on Dec 22, 2009 6:09 PM EST up reply actions
do you mean “moron”? I think it’s silly to think some people are on roids unless there is proof that states otherwise. Take Shogun for example, many people were saying he was on roids in Pride and that was the reason he was doing bad in the UFC. They didn’t take into account the injuries he had as a possible reason for his bad performances. Shogun has been tested clean for roids, there is no reason to think he is on roids. The California commission is also doing of season tests for the people who could possibly be cycling roids. Granted, there could still be people who are going to get away with it, since no system is perfect. But unless there is proof showing someone is roiding, there is no reason to just start accusations, which would be ignorant and naive to do so…
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
I believe you meant “moron.” Please refrain from making personal insults. And if you do, please at least have the courtesy of spelling your insult properly.
I love me some Sexyama!
by pud333 on Dec 22, 2009 12:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If I meant moron I woulda said moron, not insulting anyone. Apparently not aware of thhe get a brain guy
by kanodogg on Dec 22, 2009 12:22 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
You can’t merely change the spelling of an insult and say you weren’t insulting someone.
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 22, 2009 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
I have no idea what you just said.
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 22, 2009 12:43 PM EST up reply actions
Tongue in cheek brah, tongue in cheek
by kanodogg on Dec 22, 2009 12:37 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
get your tongue oaway from my cheeks. i am not a ladies under garment, bra
Even a broken clock is right two times a day.
by Chris Toffer on Dec 22, 2009 11:43 PM EST up reply actions
Replace sherk with Stephan bonnar then
by kanodogg on Dec 22, 2009 11:39 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Tim Sylvia
had all the classic signs of juicing. Right? Right?
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
Diego
He once said it was his destiny to remain undefeated and be the man to take the WW title away from Matt Hughes after a dozen defenses, thereafter retiring undefeated as the UFC WW Champion.
Will yourself into that, Sanchez!
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 22, 2009 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
Let's just level the playing field already!!
Make P.E.D.s legal. Problem solved. Baseball players can hit balls 750 feet! Yeah! Football players can run 40 yards in 1.6 seconds! Yeah! Hockey players can skate super fast! Yeah! MMA fighters can fly! Yeah! If an athlete wants to inject a heart attack time bomb into themselves to be a better athlete why are we keeping them from doing this? Spectator sports can only benefit. Someone explain why we don’t legalize P.E.D.’s.
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
MMA fighters can fly! Yeah!
haha
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Mariusz Pudzianowski is working on that.
Keep firing Assholes!
Fedor has accomplished nothing until he fights Kimbo.
He’s the launching system that allows MMA fighters to fly. Fling!
by woomikee on Dec 22, 2009 2:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
For the people defending BJ...
What Valentino is saying is just what BJ himself has said in the past. BJ has accused GSP of steroids as recently as last August.
Penn said he believes St. Pierre uses steroids, though he concedes he has no proof. St. Pierre is arguably the sport’s most popular fighter and Penn knows that making such allegations isn’t going to win him any friends.
Penn, though, isn’t the type to be shy about offering his opinion though it may be unpopular.
"It’s just my opinion that he uses steroids," Penn said. "That’s it. My opinion. I do believe it. I can’t hand you any proof, but that’s my opinion."
Source: Yahoo
I love watching BJ fight, he’s just a monster at LW, and he knows how to hype a fight. However, his personality sucks. You can’t just make accusations without proof.
I love me some Sexyama!
by pud333 on Dec 22, 2009 11:57 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Its been a while since BJ said that. Since the Florian fight, I havent heard Penn say anything about GSP w/c makes me believe he has moved on. This is just his trainer feeling the need to justify the loss to GSP for whatever its worth.
I am. I think. I will. - Ayn Rand
BJ Penn moving on? I doubt this guy ever lets go of anything. Guaranteed after his next title defense, he’s going to want another crack at GSP. He’s constantly said he wasn’t given a fair shot last time, that GSP cheated. Of course I cannot read his mind, but that interview was just a few months ago. He makes Mir’s mancrush on Lesnar look normal when it comes to his obsession.
I love me some Sexyama!
I dont see Penn as a guy needing somebody else to speak his mind. Penn was pretty humble w/ Florian and Sanchez.. I truly believe he has moved on. Sure he may want GSP again and despise him for beating him.. But Penn carried himself respectfully this past few months. I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt.
I am. I think. I will. - Ayn Rand
Penn doesn’t need anyone to talk for him, that’s for sure, but I don’t think he’s moved on. Though I do agree his conduct has been greatly improved as of late, wanting to just fight for the fans and all. I give him props for that, but I remain cautious. I want to like Penn again, so I’m trying. But Valentino spouting off like that is something Penn has to control if he truly wants people to think he’s over the drama.
I love me some Sexyama!
Seriously!
Why am I the only one who suggests legalizing P.E.D.‘s in all sports when this issue comes up? Wouldn’t it be really awesome?
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
there are health risks involved, that is the primary reason it is banned (that’s what I take on the matter anyhow, I’m no expert though).
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
There are very serious health risks actually but who cares? Participating in a MMA bout has serious health risks. Lets not think about the health risks though. Lets think about the potential awesomeness!!!
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
fighters safety….. first and foremost :P
I care about these athletes enough to worry about their health.
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
I’m with you there. There should be no grounds for PEDs to be used in MMA. Though Warhand isn’t the first to suggest such a thing. I’ve heard this stuff before, legalizing PEDs and whatnot.
I love me some Sexyama!
Hmmmm P.E.D.'s aren't really about fighter safety IMO.
Oh, I am all for fighter safety. This is not the same issue though. Fighter safety, to me, involves stopping fights before serious head injury, making sure finger and toe nails are trimmed, making sure the cage door is closed and latched and keeping the fans from groping the fighter’s during their entrance walk. If a fighter chooses to take P.E.D.’s knowing that it will most likely cause a heart attack earlier than they normally would have, I say let them.
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
no, but if there are in fact health risks, then banning it is part of fighter’s safety. It doesn’t really matter if it affects the person in the long run, and sometimes we have to save people from themselves from doing bad things, even adults.
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
The real health risks come when athletes have to take them illegally. With proper medical supervision the health risks are minimalized. You know like abortion.
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
yeah, I’ve read that below, I’m still curious though, I’m going to copy and paste here:
As I’ve said, I am no expert on this, but I’m curious; If PED is banned for sportsmanship and not for health risks, then why would it be illegal? If everyone is doing them, wouldn’t it level the playing field? If they are just simply enhancing drugs with no health risks (by the use of a doctor), than why not ban all other forms of enhancing vitamins that are currently legal to take?
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
If you legalize PED’s it will turn out that 90% of fighters are walking pharmacies. It’s like with weight cutting, you want to have advantage, and if it’s legal you will eat that shit untill your skin is green.
Now when it’s illegal, fighters at leasts have to watch out to not test positive…
by dancingChicken on Dec 22, 2009 1:00 PM EST up reply actions
the problem with this type of attitude is that proper medical supervision is expensive and hard to come by.
By legalizing PEDs you are essentially mandating them, and that makes the sport a lot more expensive to get into, and a lot more dangerous.
Hmmm, This is the first time I have heard the “it makes the sport too expensive argument”. It is better than some of the other arguments against PEDs but good training is pretty expensive too and not all fighters can afford good training.
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
…but bad training is better than bad steroids…
by dancingChicken on Dec 22, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions
that’s not just an MMA argument, that’s all sports.
The problem isn’t at the professional level, the problem is at the high school/college level. If the pros are doing it, you need to start using in high school and college to have a chance to get into the pros. The risks are higher at that age, and I don’t really expect people that age to do it properly, which makes even more risks.
You'd think so but not really.
Look at all the professional wrestlers that have just been destroyed by them
Japan agrees.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
The risks of doctor supervised steroid use are pretty minimal, actually. Banning them leads to jerkoffs injecting Mexican horse testosterone into their asses, or out of control use (pro bodybuilding) which is where the problems really begin.
Steroids & such are illegal for sportsmanship reasons. And that’s were the argument should be. The Olympics are supposed to be a bunch of amateurs striving to achieve the maximum human performance. Is doping to achieve super human achievement really consonant with the principles and ideals of sports? That’s the issue, not health stuff.
"an excellent example of why most MMA "journalism" is a joke. Pseudonyms like "toxic" and shitty writing like that dopey article"--- Joe Rogan.
Athletes want every edge possible. Some are willing to go to further lengths to achieve athletic superiority than others. One athlete is willing to take P.E.D.‘s and another isn’t so the athlete that isn’t willing to take them is upset that it’s not fair. What is not fair? It’s not fair that one athlete is willing to take steroids and the other isn’t? So now we have to run around testing everyone. To keep it fair? To maintain good sportsmanship?
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
As I’ve said, I am no expert on this, but I’m curious; If PED is banned for sportsmanship and not for health risks, then why would it be illegal? If everyone is doing them, wouldn’t it level the playing field? If they are just simply enhancing drugs with no health risks (by the use of a doctor), than why not ban all other forms of enhancing vitamins that are currently legal to take?
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
Look here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bN_FJLplScU
GSP’s pro debut back when he was a garbageman from Merdesplat Quebec back in 2002.
GSP has always been a monster, even when he didn’t have money for a fancy steroid regimen.
Keep firing Assholes!
Fedor has accomplished nothing until he fights Kimbo.
by Ubernoober on Dec 22, 2009 12:34 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
Does Merde mean shit in French?
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 22, 2009 12:44 PM EST up reply actions
Woot
Now, I will rec you (not wreck, that would change this comment entirely).
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 22, 2009 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
I am no roid expert, but I believe we were having this same debate back in the McGwire days. Mark would never do that! GSP is loved by all, he is the poster boy for the UFC. However, in life, there are rarely people that so outclass everyone else that there is not a reason. The big difference with a GSP than say a Silva is that GSP was always good … but he transitioned to great very quickly. Why is it that he can take people down so powerfully now? I am not saying that he is doing roids, but the theory is not out of the question. This is the reason for having weight classes, so that no one person is so overdominant over another powerwise at any given weight. How did GSP make that transition? Could be just new skills, but he seems to have gained a lot of power recently. The fact that he did grease also leads me to believe that he is open to other things in pursuit of greatness. Just ask Marion Jones.
You’re comparing GSP to McGwire?
OK, where are the photos of GSP adding 40 lbs of pure muscle, as McGwire did? GSP has stayed in the same weight class, and has no more muscle mass than any pro athlete could add in 6 years of professional training.
GSP also is subjected to both random and scheduled drug testing. MLB didn’t have testing in the 80s and 90s.
by Hardcharger on Dec 22, 2009 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
Fedor appears to have abnormal strength. Is he on steroids?
The takedowns of GSP are the result of impeccable timing and great technique. GSP trains with the Canadian Olympic wrestling team so he might know a thing ot two about wrestling.
Keep firing Assholes!
Fedor has accomplished nothing until he fights Kimbo.
How did GSP make that transition?
Um… through a good strength and conditioning program, and training with the elite (he trains with Canadian olympic wrestlers), not to mention natural talent and excellent technique. Clearly you missed Nate’s excellent Judo Chop on his takedowns:
In the first takedown, we see St. Pierre attempt to run the pipe off of the single leg only to switch to a double leg to finish. When running the pipe to finish the single, you’re circle your back leg clockwise or counterclockwise (depending on which leg it is, but the motion is always to the rear) while you pressure your chest down on the thigh of your opponent. This forces them off balanced hopping on one leg while you drive them down. In this instance, St. Pierre attempts to run the pipe, but a strong Alves resists. Sensing he can’t get Alves to the mat off the single leg alone, St. Pierre uses Alves’ balancing leg – also the supporting leg – to transition to and subsequently finish the double. A double, mind you, that’s aided by St. Pierre changing angles on the takedown at the last push. This is an impressive, athletic feat and one St. Pierre has likely drilled under the tutelage of the world-class wrestlers on the Canadian national wrestling team (and the others he trains with).
GSP has always been an amazing athlete. Not all men are created equal. Some men are just that much better than the rest in terms of athletics.
I love me some Sexyama!
I'm Just Saying
Listen, I thought I was clear that I WAS NOT comparing GSP to McGwire, but made the reference to that because McGwire was loved the same as GSP and that athletes like that no one wants to believe they could do that because of their personality. Clearly from your emotional response you have the same reaction. I would hate to find out that GSP was doing roids and hope that he is not because I am so amazed at him athletically. However, if that announcement ever came, I wouldn’t be surprised.
That being said, I do believe that someone can make huge strides in their strength and conditioning through natural means, its just rare to make THAT big of a change. A reasonable observation.
“However, in life, there are rarely people that so outclass everyone else that there is not a reason”
I think this is entirely untrue. In every sport and in every division of every sport there’s always going to be a full spectrum of talent. Lebron James, Tiger Woods, Kobe Bryant, Federer, all have made the most elite of their class look like complete clowns and done so without the use of steroids. It doesn’t take a reasonable amount of logic to separate GSP’s success from potential roid use. His win over Thiago Alves is a good example. Thiago has twice the muscle that GSP has. He’s the much bigger and stronger of the two, and yet Georges humiliated him. Likewise with Fitch, who is also the bigger and stronger of the two. GSP completely dominated them and strength from roids had nothing to do with it (because strength wasn’t the advantage there). GSP got beat by BJ in the first round of their first fight, and GSP doesn’t look much different now then in that fight. GSP has honed his mind and his technique and that is why he’s so much more dominant. I’m not saying that he’s not roiding, but it’s as likely that GSP is roiding as is any other fighter that has had the same physique all through his training.
your choices for sport examples proves something
your comparing the top of basketball golf and tennis…. sorry but these are some of the few sports I dont expect to see alot of roids in… although I wouldnt be surprised. you might as well take roids for billiards.
There are other kinds of PEDs than just roids. I can definitely believe that there are some kinds of PEDs that help in billiards.
And as for golf and tennis… having muscles and cardio won’t exactly hurt late in the game.
by Monday Morning Martial Artist on Dec 23, 2009 4:17 AM EST up reply actions
Dude, you get a big fail for your understanding of my comment. Did you read it at all before you responded?
You made the argument that because GSP so outclasses people that it’s rarely for no reason (ie: potentially steroids). So I said, referring to sports where there aren’t commonly steroids, that it isn’t rare for athletes to completely outclass other elite athletes. In fact, there’s at least one in every sport, and roids has nothing to do with it; therefore the fact that these athletes completely outclas their peers without roiding is proof that there’s no more likelihood GSP is roiding based on your argument. Was that clear, because
oh no you didnt!
dude.. i love the judo chops like everyone.. but they are not even close to the real bible of pure technique. you act as if quoting one your quoting a given.. I dont even know wrestling but I can tell you that st.pierre didnt do any extrodinary display of technique.. he mearly switched between a single and a double. It was his athleticism that finishes any of his tDs.
Everybody that is more muscular than I am is a cheater
GSP is doing all sorts of illicit drugs and has cybernetic enhancements. Guilty before proven innocent!!
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
by Blackout612 on Dec 22, 2009 12:59 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I'm afraid that won't do
More like flamethrower and harpoon gun. They’re super-soldiers, man! Get it together, we’re all gonna die!
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
This means Franca is innocent. Quick, somebody call Keizer!
by dancingChicken on Dec 22, 2009 2:05 PM EST up reply actions
It's strange...
Similar to Tiger Woods, GSP seems to be one of the more protected MMA athletes. Some of you guys are so willing to accuse fighters of cheating, greasing, using steroids, and being dirty fighters, yet GSP gets a free pass. Since GSP is a favorite among you, he gets a free pass, even though there are steroid suspicions among other fighters that also have never tested positive.
I wouldn’t be shocked if GSP uses HGH. Hell, I wouldn’t be surprised if 90% of pro MMA fighters are using some type of banned substance.
Is it truly out of the realm of reason that GSP does use steroids? If he does, he clearly would be able to test clean, especially since PED testing for MMA seems so useless at the moment.
Since GSP is a favorite among you, he gets a free pass, even though there are steroid suspicions among other fighters that also have never tested positive.
I’d argue that it is wrong to accuse anyone of using steroids unless it has been proven. That includes everyone, even people like Alistair Overeem whom seems to be the most suspicious by the majority of the community at the time.
cagar é uma filosofia profunda...
a merda bate na água e a água bate na bunda.
by Orcus on Dec 22, 2009 1:46 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
So if it’s impossible to disprove something, it’s true?
In that case is it out of the realm of reason that there is a fine china cutlery set floating out in space in the asteroid belt between Jupiter and Mars?
Keep firing Assholes!
Fedor has accomplished nothing until he fights Kimbo.
Don't mean to get all relig-ulous here, but
Teapot theory.
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
Since GSP is a favorite among you, he gets a free pass, even though there are steroid suspicions among other fighters that also have never tested positive.
It’s not about getting a free pass. It’s about having proof before you accuse someone. Last I checked, everyone is presumed innocent until proven guilty. Just replace “does steroids” with “is a rapist” or “is a molester.” I don’t see any difference because it’s all false accusations without any concrete evidence.
I love me some Sexyama!
I always just assumed
that GSP was an alien sent here to humiliate our men and mate with our women.
by MMA_Messiah on Dec 22, 2009 2:17 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
He is--
He’s French Canadian.
"I’m sorry. I didn’t drink last night, so I’m not funny today."
-Sakuraba
Do people not know other people that look similar to Georges? His physique isn’t THAT freaky. I mean it’s impressive, but my older brother growing up looked similar and I see guys that look like that at the gym all the time. He’s blessed with a great body and unique atheleticism, I don’t understand why that means he’s roiding. The fact is, none of us know that he is or isn’t, but it’s as likely that Georges roids as Koscheck and Fitch and Hughes. If you want to look at sheer probability from physical appearance, look at Thiago Alves. I’m not saying he’s roiding, but his physique has gone from normal to monster in his time in the UFC. I also understand the accusations of Megareem. While no one knows whether it’s true or not, I can see the suspicions. But for GSP, until there’s something out of the ordinary that turns heads, it’s total immaturity and irresponsible to go on stating that he roids. It speaks more about BJ/his corner then it says anything about GSP.
roids in mma isnt about being big..
umm think of josh barnett.
True, people are confusing anabolic steroids with other forms of PED’s that build muscle endurance, speed up recovery allowing people train harder, and stuff like that. I’m no expert on this shit, but it looks like only people with impressive physique are accused of roiding… even though it’s Francas, Gracies and Sylvias of the world that were caught using PED’s.
by dancingChicken on Dec 23, 2009 4:01 AM EST up reply actions
No but that seems to be the proof that a lot of people put out there, including BJ himself (he said that normal fighters don’t look like that all the time, they get fat and then they get in shape for the fight). And there’s also going to be a general change in overall build/mass. Not necessarily super cut but maybe.
I’m sort of surprised at the lack of perspective a lot of corners are showing. These guys are in the highest competition in the world, and yet they bait their athletes into apathy. Telling them they lost unfairly, telling them they’re winning the fight when it’s way too close to call, keeping them from reality.
The best thing that BJ needs is someone that isn’t afraid of admitting the truth. “BJ, you got your ass kicked out there you better do something about it” etc. I dunno, it’s weird to me that any corner would blow hot air up their fighters’ ass the way BJ’s and others I see do.
Rudy V seems to be a pretty big unpolished turd of a man and trainer (except for his kick ass mustache). I always chuckle a little when he yells “let the hands go BJ” which seems to be the only piece of advice he has to offer.
Yeah because the fighter he trains sure hasn't done much up to this point.....
Unpolished turd of a man and trainer? That’s a little much.
Perhaps but it’s irresponsible to make such claims, as RV has, and I think BJ is simply loyal to him. BJ’s also smart enough to train with other people who know what they’re doing (and he in fact has done so).
by The Darkness on Dec 23, 2009 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
Rudy Valentino is a god!!!
Rudy Valentino is your father!!!!
Even a broken clock is right two times a day.
by Chris Toffer on Dec 23, 2009 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
Hey, now we know who Rampage got his coaching style from!
by Monday Morning Martial Artist on Dec 22, 2009 5:45 PM EST up reply actions
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