Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: VIDEO: Austin Rivers' Buzzer Beater Finishes Off UNC

UFC 107 Preview: Who Can Stop BJ Penn?

via Sherdog.com

Over at Sherdog.com, Jason Probst does some handicapping and takes a look at the UFC lightweight division after an assumed win over Sanchez:

Who’ll turn the trick? If one cross-compared the skill sets of all five UFC champions, Penn rates the best from a pound-for-pound perspective. He has proven a solid striker with subtle stand-up defense and a granite chin, and he gives opponents fits in a tie-up, whether he defends a takedown or attempts one. He has also proven incredibly dominant from top position, and once he obtains it, the fight essentially ends. There are better wrestlers (Brock Lesnar and Georges St. Pierre) and strikers (Anderson Silva, Lyoto Machida and St. Pierre), but Penn has proven more dangerous from more ranges and positions than any of them.

The big challenge for Penn remains himself and staying motivated to defend his crown. Forever in search of greater tests, his lightweight reign could become an amazing one, given the depth of the division and high-energy foes. Aggressive scrappers like Sanchez, Gray Maynard, Frankie Edgar and Tyson Griffin comprise the top tier of deserving challengers. It provides a full cupboard for the Hilo, Hawaii, native and could serve up a memorable reign if he brings his "A" game for the next few years.

If Penn loses his 155-pound crown, it will be to an opponent pitching a perfect game -- likely a great wrestler with good stand-up and the tenaciousness to wear down Penn, a la St. Pierre.

All of these questions are important given that the math portends a change of hands in title holders quicker than we imagine:

Yet for the seeming convergence of dominant champions, a UFC title itself has not proven a long-running job description in the past. With the average UFC championship reign at just 1.38 defenses, being "top dog" in a given division rarely lends itself to a lengthy streak of defenses. A breakdown of the math follows:

Lightweight: 3 reigns, 4 defenses, 1.33 defenses per reign
Welterweight: 8 reigns, 14 defenses, 1.75 defenses per reign
Middleweight: 5 reigns, 8 defenses, 1.6 defenses per reign
Light Heavyweight: 10 reigns, 15 defenses, 1.5 defenses per reign
Heavyweight: 14 reigns, 10 defenses, 0.71 defenses per reign.

For tabulation purposes, a scheduled bout does not count as a successful defense if a challenger misses weight or the match takes place between an interim titleholder and champion.

That’s why the current crop of champions is different. If you lined up all five, it would be a tough call to guess how many defenses each would make during their current reigns. Outside of light heavyweight titleholder Lyoto Machida, none of them have a challenger who registers less than 3-to-1 to dethrone them, and each has a good shot at making a lengthy run. UFC middleweight king Anderson Silva currently holds the promotional record for consecutive title defense with five, along with Tito Ortiz.

There are many who complain that the champions of these divisions cannot be touched by the challengers, so what is the point?

I don't so much mind it, truthfully. Given how often titles change hands, at least statistically speaking, it's nice to see a division cleaned out top to bottom, if a champion can produce such an outcome. Count me in as one who is all in favor of eras, reigns and streaks. It makes the business of ending them far more interesting.

107_medium 

Comment 50 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

Dominant Champions
Count me in as one who is all in favor of eras, reigns and streaks. It makes the business of ending them far more interesting.

Agreed.

I think that complaints that there a not challengers to a champion are silly. Essentially, the complain becomes “this champion is too dominant.”

What a horrible circumstance.

...Behold, a pale horse. The man that sat upon it was Wieters, and hell followed with him.

"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard

by Brett Jones on Nov 25, 2009 10:52 AM EST reply actions  

Having dominant champions just adds value to the Title. Before Machida/Shogun now, the Light Heavyweight Division was in a state where everyone could beat each other, so there really wasn’t a clear number one fighter in that division. Outside of a Matt Serra win, whoever knocks off the champion will be seen as the true number one in their respective weight class.

by chrisbboy82 on Nov 25, 2009 12:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Precisely.

...Behold, a pale horse. The man that sat upon it was Wieters, and hell followed with him.

"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard

by Brett Jones on Nov 25, 2009 12:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Hoe can he concede thst GSP is a better wrestler and striker (his words) yet call Penn the best P4P?

by ufc4 on Nov 25, 2009 10:57 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

Presumably because Georges St. Pierre weighs more than BJ.

...Behold, a pale horse. The man that sat upon it was Wieters, and hell followed with him.

"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard

by Brett Jones on Nov 25, 2009 11:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Because BJ is better is more dangerous off his back and in top position, he’s just not as adept as GSP as getting the fight to the ground.

by Chris Barton on Nov 25, 2009 11:36 AM EST up reply actions  

I think Fedor is the most dangeours on the ground, his gnp is the most dangeours i think i have ever seen, But i believe GSP has better postion and control while on top or really anywhere on the ground in MMA.

Everyone has a game plan, untell they get hit.

by mma is #1 on Nov 25, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Would “more of a threat to end the fight” be better?

Giving Shogun his props. I had the fight 48-47 Machida but Shogun put up a monumental performance and I am honored to have seen it in person.

by Day Man on Nov 25, 2009 2:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Calling GSP a better striker doesn't jibe with the facts

Fightmetric agrees: GSP is a great striker ON THE GROUND. His GnP is the most vicious in MMA. But on the feet he doesn’t land as often, he doesn’t throw as many power punches, and he doesn’t knock many people out.

BJ is a better striker than GSP. AND better P4P.

But none of that matters because I’d suggest that GSP is more dominant because his wrestling is SO good that he doesn’t need to be as well-rounded, in the same way that A.Silva doesn’t need great wrestling because his striking is so good.

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.

by jemaleddin on Nov 25, 2009 1:19 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I dont think so, in the Thiago Alves fight GSP was beating him in the stand up(Thiago was suposed to be the most dangeous stand up fighter in the WW divison), and even in the 2nd BJ fight he was winning the stand-up. BJ is up there for P4P, but is not better then the top 3(anderson, GSP, fedor).
Also, BJ is very good on the ground, but he couldnt DO ANYTHING to GSP, even if they where both in the same weight class, GSP would of dominated the ground easly(with or without vasoline).

Just my 2 cents….

Everyone has a game plan, untell they get hit.

by mma is #1 on Nov 25, 2009 1:39 PM EST up reply actions  

...make 155?

Cause I don’t think so.

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.

by jemaleddin on Nov 25, 2009 1:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Any bets on which reign ends first?

And how?

..I have the feeling the first reign to end will come from that person moving up, getting injured, Or stripped, etc.. Instead of actually losing the fight..

by Anton Tabuena on Nov 25, 2009 11:05 AM EST reply actions  

Machida

"Shotguns? What, like guns that fire shots?"
@deowade

by Damon O. on Nov 25, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions  

Anderson Silva retirement/elbow/boredom/mental breakdown.

Keep firing Assholes!

In Idaho, it's illegal to f--- a porcupine. You know why? Because someone tried it.

by Ubernoober on Nov 25, 2009 11:12 AM EST up reply actions  

Machida's reign ended when he fought Shogun.

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.

by jemaleddin on Nov 25, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions  

Except that, y’know, it didn’t.

Guillotine.

by iiowyn on Nov 25, 2009 9:08 PM EST up reply actions  

…would get worked on the feet

by Tonley on Nov 27, 2009 8:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Diego is going to get wrecked. Anyone with a good chance of taking out BJ Penn at 155 should be demolishing guys like Joe Stevenson and Clay Guida.

I would like to see BJ shoot for more takedowns though. It would open up his striking even more because people would be worried about being underneath BJ on the ground. His top game is just brutal.

by MMAEruption on Nov 25, 2009 11:21 AM EST reply actions  

awesome

I still remember seeing the the blood shoot out like a super soaker once he applied that choke.

by HappyLittleTreez on Nov 25, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions  

Poor Joe.

Keep firing Assholes!

In Idaho, it's illegal to f--- a porcupine. You know why? Because someone tried it.

by Ubernoober on Nov 25, 2009 11:31 AM EST up reply actions  

Doesn't he deserve a rematch?

(If only to see him get beat down again?)

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.

by jemaleddin on Nov 25, 2009 1:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh man, thats the first time I’ve seen the BJ cabbage patch kid photoshop. Hilarious.

Giving Shogun his props. I had the fight 48-47 Machida but Shogun put up a monumental performance and I am honored to have seen it in person.

by Day Man on Nov 25, 2009 2:58 PM EST up reply actions  

"If one cross-compared the skill sets of all five UFC champions, Penn rates the best from a pound-for-pound perspective."

Bullshit he does.

Although detractors decry (MMA) as a brutal, bloody form of human cockfighting, aficionados know it is a brutal, bloody, totally fucking awesome form of human cockfighting. -The Onion

by The Kittitas Kid on Nov 25, 2009 11:32 AM EST reply actions  

Agreed

He does not have the best striking (Anderson Silva)

or best wrestling (GSP)

by Meshuggeth on Nov 25, 2009 12:03 PM EST up reply actions  

you do know you compared two different guys to say that he isn’t the best right at certain fields right?

by Anton Tabuena on Nov 25, 2009 12:08 PM EST up reply actions  

What?

I said he is neither the champion with best striking or wrestling

by Meshuggeth on Nov 25, 2009 12:25 PM EST up reply actions  

That's not what the quote means, I think...

I think he’s trying to say that even though he isn’t the best striker or best wrestler, he has the Fedor advantage. He’s strong everywhere you want to fight him and transitions well. He’ll lose a wrestling match, he’ll lose in K1 or muay thai, but he’s the king of MMA.

I somewhat disagree with that assessment, but I think that’s his point.

by pdl on Nov 25, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions  

He’s not, though. GSP is a superior striker, wrestler, and grappler, as he has demonstrated on more than one occasion.

Although detractors decry (MMA) as a brutal, bloody form of human cockfighting, aficionados know it is a brutal, bloody, totally fucking awesome form of human cockfighting. -The Onion

by The Kittitas Kid on Nov 25, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions  

I guess we’ll just chalk those 15 billion guard passes up to luck, then, unless you’re going to trot out the tired grease bullshit.

Although detractors decry (MMA) as a brutal, bloody form of human cockfighting, aficionados know it is a brutal, bloody, totally fucking awesome form of human cockfighting. -The Onion

by The Kittitas Kid on Nov 25, 2009 3:58 PM EST up reply actions  

I was going to

trot out his BBJ pedigree. And why would you feel the need to use profanity towards me statement? GSP is a better wrestler by far, but he will never be the grappler BJ is.

You need to understand there is a difference between wrestling and grappling. Wrestling is takedowns, takedown defense etc, grappling is a whole different set of skills. This is why people train while wrestlets and BBJ camps. 2 diciplines.

by Riney on Nov 26, 2009 11:45 AM EST up reply actions  

Which one is guard passing?

Pretty sure that’s grappling.

Although detractors decry (MMA) as a brutal, bloody form of human cockfighting, aficionados know it is a brutal, bloody, totally fucking awesome form of human cockfighting. -The Onion

by The Kittitas Kid on Nov 28, 2009 9:59 PM EST up reply actions  

If you’re talking about BJ being better at pure BJJ than GSP, yes, BJ would be better, but in the context of MMA involving wrestling and strikes, it’s debatable. All I know is that GSP owned Penn on the ground and not only physically destroyed him, but psychologically broke him with all those guard passes.

I love me some Sexyama!

by pud333 on Nov 25, 2009 4:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Was that a joke?

Saying BJ Penn is better might be a defensible position, saying “GSP isn’t in the same league” is completely ridiculous. You saw their last fight right?

by ufc4 on Nov 25, 2009 6:43 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't think you understand what "pound-for-pound" and "cross-compared" mean.

And I’m not going to waste time educating you or the other people that continue to misunderstand.

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.

by jemaleddin on Nov 25, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions  

See above. GSP is best P4P cross modally.

Although detractors decry (MMA) as a brutal, bloody form of human cockfighting, aficionados know it is a brutal, bloody, totally fucking awesome form of human cockfighting. -The Onion

by The Kittitas Kid on Nov 25, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Count me in as one who is all in favor of eras, reigns and streaks.

I’m all for reigns and eras. When I like the champ, like GSP, I love rooting for them. When I don’t like the champ, I love rooting against them. I would love to see Machida go on a tear at LHW, because this whole game of musical chairs with the title lately has been annoying. Personally, I don’t mind seeing someone clear out a division. And I really don’t think anyone should be moving up without clearing out that said division, which is why I’m all for Silva dropping the title and moving to LHW so MW can be rejuvenated.

I love me some Sexyama!

by pud333 on Nov 25, 2009 1:01 PM EST reply actions  

I think only bj can stop himself, by not being in condition and gassing. In the florian fight he showed he can get someones will imposed on him for 3 rounds then come out in the fourth and throw an opponent down like a rag doll and take their neck home. If he can maintain that level of conditioning he is unstoppable at 155. Thats a big “if” that I only see lasting 2-3 more defenses.

by brooksto on Nov 25, 2009 8:33 PM EST reply actions  

I’m not completely sold on GSP being the better striker. Yes, he beat the hell out of BJ, but he’s also a lot bigger, & significantly better at wrestling. Take either away, and I’m not sure he beats BJ standing up, so from a pure striking standpoint, I’d give the nod to BJ (but not by all that much). Just my opinion though.

by jhf884 on Nov 26, 2009 10:32 AM EST reply actions  

Forgive me if this is a repeater

..cos I haven’t had time to finish reading the other posts but I don’t see how GSP has the most brutal & effective GNP when he never seems to finish fights anymore with GNP or otherwise. I don’t deny he has phenominal wrestling & he does some damage on the ground but come on, he brutalized Alves for 5 rounds, dominated him & payed on a beating but he couldn’t put him away & he couldn’t keep him down either, the same vs fitch.
Hypothetically if bj had gsps wrestling I believe they wouldve both looked like Joe daddy inside of 3 rounds..
Also a final point, some of the most fearsome GNP I’ve ever seen belongs to Brock lesnar, he makes people look like they have mashed potato for faces..

Be like water..

by theredoctober on Nov 26, 2009 6:20 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

Or he laid a beating on them rather than payed, whichever..

Be like water..

by theredoctober on Nov 26, 2009 6:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

"I don't want to knock my opponent out. I want to hit him, step away and watch him hurt" - Joe Frazier

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Walshrun_small
5 Reasons I Hate MMA
Royce_09_small
Call To Nominate New Bloody Elbow Moderators
Obp_small
The Official BE UFC Drinking Game
Jules-winfield-7_small
5 Reasons I Hate the UFC
Small
Pushing Nick Diaz - A Study in Match Making

Recent FanPosts

Bruce-lee-lats_small
Calling for Nick Diaz to be released makes no sense.
Afro_small
The UFC Has Been Spared Once Again...This Time by Carlos Condit
Small
Suddenly Diego Sanchez vs. Jake Ellenberger Meas A LOT
Thumbnailca0h0gv2_small
Difference Between TRT & THC
Image_small
Nick Diaz is a Rebel and He Doesn't Give a Shit.
Chinese-hong-kong-large-flag-hk_small
Barboza, Thompson, eat your heart out (now with 2 Tornado Kick KOs!)
Elty_small
Why An Immediate Rematch with Nick Diaz is the BEST Career Move for Carlos Condit
Small
Why Diaz vs. Condit 2 is a great idea

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

MMA Rankings

USA Today / SB Nation Consensus MMA Rankings