The UFC is interested in Shane Carwin (11-0 MMA, 4-0 UFC) vs. Cain Velasquez (7-0 MMA, 5-0 UFC) for the Interim UFC Heavyweight title.
According to Carwin on the UG.
about 2 years ago
Nick Thomas
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Damn straight
I’m ready for this! Let’s do it!
I'm the kind of girl who loves to watch a GOOD fight!
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I have no problems with interim titles
The point of them is to prevent what we have here, a litney of injuries that put a division on hold. We all know Lesnar is the champ, but creating an interim title allows there to be big fights in that division while he’s out. There is some credibility . . . guys like Noguiera, St-Pierre, and Arlovski have all held interim titles and they are world renowned fighters.
Respectfully disagree. This fight is big regardless of whether some hunk of leather, plastic and brass gets waved around or not. This isn’t for the hw title, and there’s no way of getting around that.
To me, these interim matches just detract from whatever value the real belt has.
The path to my fixed purpose is laid with iron rails, whereon my soul is grooved to run. Towards thee I roll, thou all-destroying but unconquering BROCKLESNAR; to the last I grapple with thee.
by judonerd on Nov 18, 2009 11:36 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
You're missing the point.
An interim belt creates an indisputable number one contender. No BS, no getting swept aside for a new guy or someone more marketable. It’s not a new title, it’s a promise to the athlete and the fans that they are next in line.
How about an interim interim belt? To be the number one next in line for an interim match? Let’s just give everyone belts. I promised to help my girlfriend write her paper later, maybe I’ll hand her a belt for that.
The only good argument I heard is that this means the fight will be five rounds, but we can safely assume this particular fight won’t go the distance anyway.
The path to my fixed purpose is laid with iron rails, whereon my soul is grooved to run. Towards thee I roll, thou all-destroying but unconquering BROCKLESNAR; to the last I grapple with thee.
One thing I don’t like about this fight is that Cain or Carwin is going to be crowned interim champ without having to face Nog or Mir. It seems to me that either of those men have a more legitimate claim to the title. Nog was the previous interim HW champ whose loss to Mir was perhaps aided by injury and illness, and has since beaten Randy – the previous HW champ whose only loss was to Brock. And the last interim HW champ, Frank Mir, has only one recent loss, to Brock.
What I would like to see:
If Mir beats Chieck and Big Nog is healthy, a rematch early next year. Winner faces the winner of Cain/Carwin for the interim HW belt.
I don't get this argument.
Neither Mir nor Nog has that interim title anymore. They lost it in title bouts. The ‘real’ belt (Sylvia=>Randy) and the interim belt (Nog=>Mir) both converged in a unification for an undisputed champ. We know who that is. The old interim belt is irrelevant, and Nog/Mir are not de facto gatekeepers to contendership at the undisputed title. Especially when neither of them are on any sort of win streak at the moment.
To be the man you have to beat the man, right? But guess what? The man is gone, so I would think you should be able to at least beat the previous man, otherwise there is no hierarchal order to your HW division. If the winner of Cain and Carwin beats MIr and/or Nog there is no question who is the best fighter outside of Brock. But if Cain or Carwin is interim title holder and doesn’t face either of those men, then there is a question mark on the title. You’re current title holder is lower ranked on the consensus rankings than two previous title holders who they never had to face. That’s a conundrum i’m trying to do away with.
All this is pointless of course if Mir loses to Kongo.
That makes no sense at all, you might as well argue that with Brock being sick they should give the HW belt back to Randy.
R.I.P. Cain Velasquez
"Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity." - Bullet Tooth Tony
@deowade
Cain by UD for dominating ground control
yea I said it!! :-)
You think so?
I know we haven’t seen a lot of Carwin’s wrestling, but he does have a pretty impressive resume not to mention hands of STEEL.
I'm the kind of girl who loves to watch a GOOD fight!
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Yea, I think Cain is that elite
Carwin might have a good resume for wrestling, but what about his gas tank? Good wrestler vs Elite Wrestler usually ends up in turtlefuck, especially if Shane can’t keep up the pace.
No doubt
I think Carwin tank is a big ol’ ‘?’ too. I think if Cain DID win this bout I think it would definitely be by UD, HOWEVER if Cain ate a shot or two from Carwin I think it would be “good night Irene”.
I'm the kind of girl who loves to watch a GOOD fight!
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I agree
Cain either gets KTFO or wins UD. If Carwin keeps it standing, he wins. If not, WAR CAIN.
I’m going to have to agree with you. I think that many MMA fans take way too much stock in Kongo dropping Velasquez, but what many don’t realize is that Kongo utilized short hooks that Carwin may or may not have in his arsenal. While Carwin does have massive power that could potentially end the night early for Velasquez, Velasquez has the wrestling, gas tank, top control, and ground n pound to make it a long night for Carwin. While I am a fan of Carwin, but more of a fan of Velasquez, let’s not get ahead of ourselves-Carwin’s biggest win is against Gabriel Gonzaga and that’s it. While Velasquez’s biggest wins are against Kongo and Rothwell, I have seen more tools/techniques in Velasquez (unending cardio for a Heavyweight, diverse takedowns, etc) than I have seen in Carwin (extremely heavy-hitter, strong, etc).
by chrisbboy82 on Nov 18, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
While I agree with you that Gonzaga is greater and is easily more well rounded than Kongo, but their strength of record shows that they are both very similar. The main thing that is similar with these two is that both of their best victories is a win against CroCop. Other than the CroCop victories, their records are that both are beating the fighters that they are supposed to beat, but lose against higher quality talent.
I meant that skill wise, Gonzaga is above both Rothwell and Kongo. He’s got no, or little heart, but he can knock you the fuck out, beak your hand with kick or submit the shit out of you.
Kongo has absolutely no ground game (+ stupid game plans), and Rothwell is an average HW with no real skills (at least I’m not impressed with his skill set).
It;’s relatively easy too look good against those guys. Against Gonzaga not so much.
But I agree that we’ve seen more from Cain. I hope Carwin will get a chance to fight longer than 1 min, so we can see his skill too.
by dancingChicken on Nov 20, 2009 4:46 AM EST up reply actions
I…n fact Carwin didn’t look good against Gonzaga…
by dancingChicken on Nov 20, 2009 4:47 AM EST up reply actions
With 5 rounds to work
Carwin KOs Cain. Carwin may not be the better wrestler, but he is good enough to get to his feet.
Interim titles are a good reason to have 5 round fights between elite compeditors.
Keep firing Assholes!
The only thing Fishbob does consistently is dissapoint.
Good point. It also allowed Tim Sylvia to be champion. ha
by Gogoplata.com on Nov 18, 2009 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
As a big Cain fan I always worried about this fight, but after seeing Carwin in person I really think this fight will be like every velasquez fight. He’ll be able to put Carwin on his back whenever he wants and get the UD, if not tko. We’ve already seen Cain go past the 1st and 2nd rds. Carwin’s never gone past the 1st and again I really doubt Cain’s gameplan will be to stand with Carwin.
Like some of you are saying, its really about Carwin’s gas tank and takedown defense on this one. And I really doubt his wrestling is anywhere near cain’s level.
"Well... You're damned if you do, and You're damned if you don't."- Bart Simpson
by poundnground on Nov 18, 2009 12:53 PM EST via mobile reply actions
i never got why people do this. if someone hasnt gone past round one, people zone in on his cardio and use that to determine the fight. i understand to be curious if someone can prove they can fight that long, but to use it as a reason one way or the other to determine the outcome seems odd.
while cain has a shown great endurance, you have to think shane was training to go 25 against brock, and will do the same in this fight. in any event, i agree that if cain can utilize top control he has a great chance to ride out a decision. i just see shane being able to get up and stay upright long enough to deliver the knockout blow.
by sadface on Nov 18, 2009 1:39 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I don't think it's really an "odd" thing to concentrate on
Because it is a legitimate question. I think it is silly to hinge your entire argument on an unknown factor, but “odd” it is not.
I'm the kind of girl who loves to watch a GOOD fight!
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Join the DC Area UFC Meetup Group
http://www.meetup.com/DCUFCGroup
Months ago when this fight was first rumored, I said that I thought Cain had the advantage and I still do. Carwin has poor striking defense as evidenced by being repeatedly clocked by guys like Wellisch and Neil fucking Wain, while Gonzaga almost stole his lunch money. The only things keeping Carwin winning these fights has been his good chin and insane power. Essentially he just stands in front of his opponent and goads them into a gunfight, which he has the better chance of winning.
It is a very interesting fight, but I sincerely suspect that Cain will beat Carwin via decision (or perhaps submission, as both fighters’ submission ability is sort of an open question) through the use of his more technical striking and superior wrestling.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
Not sure how important the belt is in that scenario
Am I the only one who reads that line as saying the fight wouldn’t necessarily be for an Interim title?
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