The WEC Makes a Case for Its Continued Existence
by Michael Rome on Oct 12, 2009 12:00 PM EDT
in MMA News
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It's impossible to talk about the WEC these days without the discussion turning to the promotion's future. The talk this week was all about the DirecTV mess and whether the show would bomb. Regardless of how the numbers come out, the WEC delivered another tremendous night of fights last Saturday night, and gave us all a stark reminder of how much worse off we'd be as fans if we didn't get shows like this for free on a regular basis.
While guys like Urijah Faber and Miguel Torres suffer financially as a result of their weight classes being excluded from the UFC, guys like Ben Henderson really benefit from the existence of the WEC. In the UFC, Henderson could never reach co-champion status at lightweight. Fighters like Gray Maynard, Kenny Florian, and BJ Penn are light years ahead of him, and he'd quickly find himself in deep water if he fought in the UFC. But in the WEC he can be a champion and develop as a fighter. There's a lot of value there.
I'm not one of those who believes the WEC should be folded into the UFC. Why advocate against getting free great shows on a regular basis? There has to be a middle ground that allows guys like Urijah Faber, Mike Brown, Brian Bowles, Miguel Torres, and others to shine on the sport's biggest stage while simultaneously allowing guys like Ben Henderson and Jamie Varner to shine.
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that's why the WEC should be a feeder circuit with all the weightclasses.
by Anton Tabuena on Oct 12, 2009 12:02 PM EDT reply actions 6 recs
Sounds about right. Kill the WEC name though, why create 2 brands? Nobody but the hardcores know what WEC is.
Call it UFC Primetime or UFC Divisional Series or whatever…
www.tapology.com | twitter.com/tapology
I just dont like the word Extreme in my mma anymore. How Zuffa could have kept it still amazes me. Dont they want to be viewed as a sport instead of some kind of niche extreme sideshow? Especially WEC where you see so much more technique.
SHOGUN WILL SLAY THE DRAGON!!!
SHOGUN TO BE THE NEW LHW CHAMP!!!
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."
by xFenixKnightx on Oct 12, 2009 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions
fair enough… but you could extend that to “ultimate fighting championship” also. “UFC” sounds cool but the full name i little ridiculous. it was named back in ’93 and they had no idea the name and company would become what it is today.
www.tapology.com | twitter.com/tapology
Easy solution here.
Why not take advantage of the Pride purchase and rebrand it Pride Fighting Championships? I was thinking this the other day from just looking at the blue WEC gloves and it would just be kick ass. WEC sounds craptastic IMO.
SHOGUN WILL SLAY THE DRAGON!!!
SHOGUN TO BE THE NEW LHW CHAMP!!!
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."
by xFenixKnightx on Oct 12, 2009 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s better than WEC. That’s my point.
SHOGUN WILL SLAY THE DRAGON!!!
SHOGUN TO BE THE NEW LHW CHAMP!!!
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."
by xFenixKnightx on Oct 12, 2009 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions
They do tend to down play it quite a bit. WEC is 64 point font, and World Extreme Cagefighting is wee lil 12 point font, then never gets mentioned again. It’s not like they are chugging mountain dew while doing a snowboarding jump over a tank full of rabid grizzlies or something. And really, it’s no worse and maybe better than Affliction (who names a promotion after a synonym for a disease), StrikeForce (what Jean Claude Van Damme movie did they steal that one from?), Cage Rage, Shark Fights, or even Ultimate Fighting Championship. Most US promotion names kind of reek of bemulleted testosterone & axe body spray. And that’s OK.
PFC
Pen-Ultimate Fighting Championship
by slapjaw ackrite on Oct 12, 2009 9:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Penn-Ultimate Fighting Championship?
BJ Penn-Joker approves.
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
by mythbuster on Oct 12, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
yeah
been having some fun with anigifs lately
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
I’m partial to this idea as well, but I think it might be a little awkward with respect to WEC’s champions. If the WEC is a feeder league, and you’re the WEC middleweight champion (for example), shouldn’t that be your ticket to the big leagues? But if everybody who wins a title in the WEC just goes to the UFC, their titles will be constantly vacated and won’t mean anything. And if a guy has to wait to lose his title to move up, why should he get to move up and not the guy that beat him?
It might get to the point where the best WEC fighters don’t want to win WEC titles, because then they’d be stuck in the minors.
Then what would you be left with? A bunch of guys fighting at random? There has to be titles. Defend it three times, and it’s your ticket to the UFC with built-in exposure.
Fagan is for five round main events, I am not, so removing titles for me doesn’t work. I like seeing guys fight five rounds for something meaningful and the WEC allows for that even when the fighters are not the best in the world. I just think a little more fluid movement between the UFC and WEC is the key. Open the upper weights up in the WEC and put guys on cards to keep them active and guys that would otherwise be kicked out of the UFC or on the undercard. Bumping a guy to the UFC if he can win some at the lower level. But then how to handle the 145/135 and soon 125 belts? Well they are then main lure to get more eyes on WEC and not strong enough to lure more people to a UFC card. Faber and Torres didn’t make enough to retire while they were on top, but they built there star and before there run in the WEC they weren’t worth enough to the UFC to even think about opening up lower weights. I say keep them where they are.
bellator style tourney’s happening continuously in every weight class. winners make it into the UFC.
especially if you expect the ultimate fighter reality show to kick the bucket after a few more seasons, this would be a solid replacement way to win your way into the big leagues.
www.tapology.com | twitter.com/tapology
The problem with the three-defense idea is three consecutive defenses in MMA is rare (only Torres and Faber have pulled it off in the WEC), and the stronger a division, the rarer it gets. So if you have a really strong WEC division with several UFC-caliber guys, it would pretty unlikely that any one of them would defend enough times to move up, which would defeat the purpose of WEC as a feeder league.
I would make the WEC a feeder league, with Flyweight through Light-Heavyweight, and every 18 months or whatever in any given division I’d vacate the title and send the top 2-4 guys up to the UFC. Then I’d have a four-man mini-tournament to determine the next champion (or just a single Championship match in the case of LHW). I’d stagger the timing so they wouldn’t lose all their champions at once, just have two division affected once every 6 months maybe.
I’d send up the Featherweights as soon as I could, then I’d send up the Bantamweights maybe 6 months later. I’d let them keep Flyweights as an exclusive division though for a few years until a few stars develop, and maybe try to introduce a Strawweight class. Light-Heavyweight would be used sparringly. Maybe they could do a Heavyweight match once in a while that would essentially be a “winner goes to the UFC” match, but there wouldn’t be a HW title.
I agree 100% There are really good prospects that could use some experince
by Erich Vowell on Oct 12, 2009 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed until "allowing guys like...Jamie Varner to shine."
We don’t really need him anymore, do we?
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by Scott C. Broussard on Oct 12, 2009 12:13 PM EDT reply actions
I like the WEC and want it to continue pretty much as is. Talented fighters who wouldn’t be represented elsewhere, fighting on free TV and continuously putting on great shows.
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
Tho as pop gun says above me
would be nice if the fighters got paid a bit more, but I’m not sure how feasable that is right now.
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
I disagree with the “feeder league” idea. That’ what the smaller (or other) organizations are for. The WEC is for the lighter weight classes, and I belive they’re at least thinking about added to more (lighter) weight classes.
I’m a WEC fan, probably about 50/50 with UFC. Ithink Zuffa does a good job promoting WEC, but could obviously do more. Most UFC fans know the big WEC names.
I think Reed Harris does a great job promoting WEC, and Fertitta doubling the bonus for Cerrone/Henderson was also great.
I doubt this will ever happen, but Zuffa should throw in one WEC fight on a UFC pay per view, see what the fan and internet reaction is.
Disagreed...
If anything, the WEC proved that it can sell itself within the confines of the UFC. The fights alone will grab attention from fans, and all the fans telling me in my previous article about how the UFC would have a hard time getting interest from casual fans in lower weight classes are absolutely nuts. WEC 43 was the perfect example of that.
Merge the WEC with the UFC, and these fights sell themselves along with getting all the money they should be getting paid along with sponsorship dollars. They already have revenue streams in place. UFC brand name is just WAY too huge for the UFC to pass on this. WEC sells itself, sure, and they are great free figths, but… WEC 43 proves that those fighters can sell their weight classes.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
Furthermore, you can talk about how awesome the fights were… but ratings drive business, and Versus is absolutely terrible. The whole DirecTV ordeal only further crushes hope that they’ll get more fans. They need to move, period.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Oct 12, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I’ve always preferred the WEC broadcasts to the UFC. They don’t try to sell you nearly as much shit.
It’s a tough spot.
One of the main reasons that people say they want the merge to happen is because they want the WEC fighters to get more money. But the reality of the situation is, it only seems like a few fighters would be better off if they were completely in the UFC.
The top FW and BW fighters would get more on the main card of a UFC, but all of the WEC’s LW division and many of the lower tier FW and BW guys would get lost in the shuffle (not to mention how many WW-HW fighters who would get displaced by having more divisions for the UFC to sell.
I’m not sure what the solution is, but the fact that Faber re-signed shows that something is up. Maybe a solution is to give the top WEC guys an occasional showcase fight on a UFC card. The other thing I think they need to do, is help the top fighters maximize their non-fight purse income. Remember those No Fear commercials starring Faber around his defense to Brown? those didn’t happen for free and didn’t come from nowhere.
I’ve never wished for the folding of WEC. What I wanted was for the UFC just to add 145 and 135lb weight classes. Taking a select few from each WEC class and putting them in the UFC limelight and still keeping WEC as a feeder system. I went to both TX Zuffa shows and I think I enjoyed myself more in the WEC show becuase my seats were so much better and I was actually more excited for Cerrone Hendo than Franklin Belfort. Both shows were incredible though and having witnessed WEC first hand I will be furious if Zuffa decides to shut it down completely. Another thing I liked about the WEC show more than the UFC show was that there were bascially all hardcores in the stands. It’s like I was on Bloody Elbow talking with people that actually knew stuff about MMA. The UFC show… not so much. Just please no WEC PPV, keep it as a feeder system.
Side note, Varner kept getting nailed everytime he was shown on camera. lol I was scared people would start throwing stuff in the Octagon when he went in there after the fight. I’m surprised he hasn’t embraced a heel persona. He’s got HUGE potentiol there becuase when it comes down to it the guy can scrap. Hell, the heel tags been given to him like it or not. At least people would tune in to see him get his arse kicked.
SHOGUN WILL SLAY THE DRAGON!!!
SHOGUN TO BE THE NEW LHW CHAMP!!!
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."
It makes no difference to me what weight class I watch in the UFC. I never understood why they got rid of the 155ers yrs ago. I’d like to see them go all the way down to 125ers. What matters to me is skill. The problem is, whether they keep those weight classes in the WEC or bring in new weight classes in the UFC, it will mean more PPV’s. As it sits right now I already shell out 50 to 100 bucks a month for UFC ppv’s. I simply can’t afford anymore. I like the idea of having a TUF season represent the WEC. Maybe Mike Brown and Urijah Faber as coaches . Or make the Ultimate Fight Nights co-promotional with the WEC.
I don’t think it necessarily means more PPVs. I think the UFC has already learned from the WWE’s experiment in trying to do 16 PPVs a year that there is such a thing as oversaturation. If the UFC gets a network deal I expect them to do four shows a year on ABC or wherever, 12 PPVs, and more Ultimate Fight Nights than they do currently.
The fact is, they’re struggling to fill some of their PPVs with quality main-events as it is, so a couple of extra weight classes would help tremendously.
the weight classes and the top fighters will be moved into the UFC…
Reed Harris has one ppv as his last hope to realize his dream and after 2 people buy it then we can get on with our lives.
The only dynamic where WEC made sense as another marquee league (cost wise) was to take out the “other option” for every door Zuffa opens with the UFC.
example: video games. UFC opened the door and WEC should have closed it with the EA deal but it failed to.
It just doesn’t make financial or marketing sense anymore.
There will never be a number 2 to the UFC in the sense of what pepsi is to coke. There is no space for a number 2… However there’s room in the market place for a national feeder league with all weight classes and the WEC will be restructured to fill this niche. You cant fight the inevitability of market forces.
This is what I’m thinking. If the UFC takes the WEC, but they keep two seperate “leagues” so to speak, they own their own Feeder league. If Strikeforce folds some day, they could buy up all those contracts and then, bam, the UFC truly has a monopoly on the sport in North America.
"You guys are jerking eachother off with some pseudo deep bullshit." - Kid Nate
by Kaleb Kelchner on Oct 12, 2009 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Your reasoning for the WEC to stay is exactly the same for my reasoning that it should go. Shouldnt the focus of the biggest brand in the world be on the best fighters? I dont understand why the UFC needs to have a feeder league. Isnt that what undercards and smaller shows are for? Its not like they dont pick talent off regional shows at will. Couldnt they just use those shows as a feeder league?
The only real reasoning for me to keep the WEC is because its the only way for the smallest weight classes to get some attention. If they could be absorbed into the UFC and still given a spotlight there than i could care less about the WEC. To me, its only value is that it contains a good portion of the best FWs and BWs in the world.
Although more MMA is more MMA and i would still like to see some of these lower level fighters on more shows that are free on tv.
I say add a featherweight and bantamweight division to the UFC, keep the WEC around as a feeder show like a shooto or Pancrase. Bring in flyweights and bring back welterweights to the WEC since thats where most of the talent is (flyweight would obviously need to develop in America).
Then Zuffa has access to all the hot young prospects that might otherwise go on a Challengers card. The fighters get exposure on a main card, and ZUFFA gets to pay them peanuts. Win win.
The WEC is an incredible product it still gets to me the idea that people still dont’ get the benefit it has for all involved the fighter and mma fans. Faber and Torres aren’t sufferering from anything we’ve been over this a thousand times if they could get bigger paydays they would. I like the fact that it’s going to stick around add more shows and throw in a ppv here and there to me that’s the best of all worlds and 2010 might be a huge year for the company.
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