UFC: Primetime Open Thread
by Michael Rome on Jan 28, 2009 8:03 PM EST
in MMA News
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The final episode of UFC: Primetime airs tonight on Spike at 10. So far the show has been largely pro-GSP, though many argue it is not biased but a true depiction of reality. However, a UFC insider dismissed some of my complaints and told me the following:
"The first two weeks are to establish the characters involved here. Penn is the bad guy, GSP is the guy fans will want to shut him up. This week is really the week dedicated to making people really need to see the fight."
I look forward to seeing it. I can't watch it live, but feel free to comment on the program as it airs in the comments. This is the episode that really counts, and if they deliver they could break their PPV record this Saturday.
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Yessir
WAR PENN.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jan 28, 2009 9:42 PM EST up reply actions
Nah.
Did you know we are in high demand, Laura?
by Eugene Schelfaut on Jan 28, 2009 9:52 PM EST up reply actions
"Penn is the bad guy, GSP is the guy fans will want to shut him up."
Really? What fans? The guy is more likable than GSP, IMHO.
I love that song
The most amazing live performance of a song I’ve ever heard was Monch doing that in central park.
Damn. Still sends goosebumps down my spine.
It is un freaking believable that Georges can competitively wrestle with Rashad Evans. Something tells me that the two would seriously have a very competitive fight even all these weight classes apart.
by Michael Rome on Jan 28, 2009 10:08 PM EST up reply actions
Well, Rashad is probably a below average size LHW who could cut to 185lbs if he wanted, while GSP is an absolutely enormous WW.
How ridiculous would that music video style intro for Rashad have been 6 months ago? Its amazing how quickly things change in the UFC these days.
Good point. The size difference isn’t huge..but Rashad is still about 20 lbs bigger than GSP and a great college wrestler. Would Rashad definitely beat GSP in a natural weight fight?
by Michael Rome on Jan 28, 2009 10:16 PM EST up reply actions
Well, I’m not sure how hard they were sparring, but I get the feeling GSP can shoot in on anybody up to about 200lbs and have success getting them down. He is like Matt Hughes 2.0 in that sense. But I just love Rashad’s standup style, he is like Black Lyoto, but with a boxing influence. He tries to time his opponents and counter them with power shots while moving in and out of the pocket. In that regard, he is on a level above GSP.
by smoogy on Jan 28, 2009 10:24 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
That’s a very objective view of Rashad, smoogy. Rec’d.
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:26 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, I forgot
He’s in the UFC so he sucks ass. I hope he grows a pair and fights Mousasi in Affliction.
You're a good man
He’s clearly dodging The Janitor. Man up already.
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
You’ve gone soft, smoogy.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Jan 28, 2009 10:40 PM EST up reply actions
He’s certainly the better striker. I have heard a lot of reports of GSP doing amazing with Rashad in the past out of that camp, this wasn’t just selective editing. In fact, anything selective may have been protecting their 205 champ.
by Michael Rome on Jan 28, 2009 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
Rashads wrestling is overrated
And I think his hands are overrated also. His movement as Smoogy pointed out is very good though. And he has a good understanding of distance.
Gimme 1 Round!
And before anybody gets self righteous
He was barely .500 in D-1. So he was a slightly above average collegiate wrestler but nothing amazing by any stretch.
Gimme 1 Round!
GSP is hardly a large WW, he is about average. Most WWs cut from 180-185. Some, like Fitch, Kos and Alves cut from even higher.
Rashad, if I remember correctly, walks around at 215.
People routinely mistake walk around weight for fighting weight. Chuck “walks around” at 225/230, but that’s cause he drinks and that is off season weight. By the time he cuts he is cutting from 213-215. Similarly, Anderson says he “walks around” at 220, but he drops a lot of weight before cutting.
Rashad is in fighting shape right around 205 lbs. He trained so hard last time he came in 2 pounds underweight.
by Michael Rome on Jan 29, 2009 4:44 AM EST up reply actions
i hooooooooope BJ wins, but i have a feeling you will drink lots of maple syrup dude..
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 29, 2009 6:58 AM EST up reply actions
Watching UFC Primetime for me is like watching the Dark Knight. I mean sure the scenes with Batman are cool, but you end up spending the whole time waiting for the scenes with the Joker.
by Sam Cupitt on Jan 28, 2009 10:15 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
Yeah GSP has Jardine, Evans, Cerrone, Marquardt, and the rest of team Jackson but he doesn’t have Mandaloniz and McCully does he?
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
As far as I know, Justin McCully is the best training partner in the world.
McCully > Fedor
lol.
by "Mr. NC-17" on Jan 28, 2009 10:15 PM EST up reply actions
I imagine the SaPM ratings back that up. I can’t be bothered to do that research myself, but just know they do.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jan 28, 2009 10:17 PM EST up reply actions
Well, if Penn is bringing in All-American wrestlers then he’ll be ok. I think.
by Luke Thomas on Jan 28, 2009 10:25 PM EST up reply actions
You’ve got GSP in this thing, don’t you?
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:27 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t think so. The problem with GSP isn’t just the wrestling, it’s how he mixes it in. What all american wrestler is going to throw a 2 or 3 strike combination ending with a takedown? Surely Kos and Fitch being completely owned in wrestling raises some questions about that.
by Michael Rome on Jan 28, 2009 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
GSP does a great job of mixing the wrestling in, but I have to ask you, who can duplicate the takedown defense of BJ? Sure, Kos and Fitch are excellent wrestlers, but they don’t have the flexibility that BJ has. I also believe that Kos was seriously surprised that GSP used so much wrestling in that fight. I know Kos’ training partners said that he didn’t train much wrestling for GSP because he was expecting a stand up fight.
The major question for me in this fight is the same question for every BJ Penn fight: Does he have enough cardio to go the distance? BJ with cardio and that takedown defense is going to present a lot of problems for GSP. People have had deep single legs on BJ, but with that flexibility he is able to sit down on his lead leg and sprawl with the back leg. It’s very unorthodox and I don’t know if there is anyone in the fight game that can duplicate that sort of flexibility.
On the feet, I believe BJ is the better overall striker. So to me, I think it comes down to GSP being able to fight for every takedown and being able to punish BJ while they are on the mat. If he can do that, he can win the fight. If it stays standing, I have to give the edge to BJ.
I am really looking forward to this fight.
Contributing writer for MMA-Analyst.com
by Joe Schmitt on Jan 28, 2009 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
I'm really surprised
Nobody uses the Cung Le kick takedown from that position. Even BJ can’t keep his balance with neither foot to catch him.
Gimme 1 Round!
Who were the All American wrestlers, other than his wrestling coach DiSibato?
Penn’s training partners can’t touch GSP’s camp. And Penn does have great TD defense, but it’s not at the level of Koscheck, Hughes, Sherk, or Fitch. GSP got 4 of 5 TDs against Penn in their first fight, and Penn had Lindland in his camp to help prepare then.
I’m not too sure though that Penn was trying to defend the takedown too much… I’m not saying that he would have defended every one of them, but at the time GSP was only a purple belt and BJ penn is… well BJ Penn and I think he felt he could submit him…. I think had round 3 been a minute longer, you are looking at a gogo or umaplata there at the end. Potentially an armbar, did you see how high his guard was? So I still think BJ was happy to be on his back…. I think this fight, he’ll be showcasing his takedown defense a littlebit better.
You need to rewatch the fight. Penn fought off a TD in Rd 1, and did a good job fighting off the TD in Rd 2, but GSP got it. The 2nd TD of Rd 2 was easier.
In Rd 3, GSP picked Penn up after Penn was defending against the fence. Nobody lets themselves get picked up and slamed.
BJ was nowhere near close to getting a gogo or omaplata in Rd 3. If fact, at the end of the Rd GSP was passing BJ’s guard when the bell rang.
BJ had plenty of chances to showcase his TD defense, and GSP is much better at it now than he was 3 years ago.
by Hardcharger on Jan 29, 2009 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
The main point you’re missing is that BJ was out of gas at that point. Like I said in my original post, BJ with cardio and that takedown defense is a bad match up for GSP.
You also failed to mention that BJ stood up after some of GSP’s takedowns. I got the feeling from watching the fight again that BJ was comfortable being on his back to rest, and when he was done resting, he got back up. If you think GSP is just going to take BJ down at will and be able to keep him there at will, I think you will be in for a big surprise.
GSP is an animal and a great wrestler, don’t get me wrong, but I’m also going to disagree with your comments about BJ’s takedown defense not being on the level of Sherk, Fitch, Hughes, Koscheck. Those are traditional wrestlers that use a traditional sprawl. BJ doesn’t use a traditional sprawl. He uses his insane flexibility to fight off takedowns. GSP really surprised Sherk with the takedown and everyone from Kos’ camp said he wasn’t prepared in the wrestling department at all. He thought GSP was going to stand and trade with him. The takedowns against Hughes were impressive, and he seriously out-muscled him. I think a lot of that had to do with Hughes being uncomfortable anywhere that fight went.
GSP is an animal and a phenomenal wrestler, I just think if BJ’s cardio is up to snuff (I know, the main question of the fight) he can really make GSP work for the takedown and punish him with dirty boxing while he is trying to shoot.
It’s a great fight and I am really pumped for it. I really don’t care who wins, I’m just hoping for a great fight.
Contributing writer for MMA-Analyst.com
I’ve been pretty confident in GSP. But now that I see that BJ has Justin McCully and Troy Mandaloniz in his training camp, I’m getting a little uncomfortable.
GSP’s training with Rashad something or another.
by Cannon Jacques on Jan 28, 2009 10:16 PM EST reply actions
Rome, unless you've having surgery
I cannot imagine why you can’t watch this live.
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:19 PM EST reply actions
I’m in class right now. I’ll be watching the fight live :)
by Michael Rome on Jan 28, 2009 10:20 PM EST up reply actions
Do you need Justin McCully to pull you through?
Did you know we are in high demand, Laura?
by Eugene Schelfaut on Jan 28, 2009 10:32 PM EST up reply actions
Balls. I don’t want to go back to college…
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:23 PM EST up reply actions
college sucks
no where to train in this podunk university town, aside from the other more typical crappy qualities of college
im not impressed with your performance
combat sports fighting for the world title = war
You have to have that kind of mind set if you want to win.
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jan 28, 2009 10:24 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe your just a BJ type of guy and I’m a GSP type of guy.
Don’t get your panties in a wad, you should go fight for a championship and see what kind of mindset you have to get in to win.
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jan 28, 2009 10:32 PM EST up reply actions
I was going to not comment here, but I sincerely hope you are a veteran if you claim to know what war is like.
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:33 PM EST up reply actions
I see where your going and both of you are correct. But thats why I used the word “mindset”. And I never claimed to know what war is like, and I don’t ever plan to, but I appreciate every man and woman who does on my behalf.
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jan 28, 2009 10:40 PM EST up reply actions
'We're all against one guy'
Now THAT is a fucking camp. Consider me an official GSP;s trainer nuthugger.
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:23 PM EST reply actions
He does have great partners man. I wont lie his team is insane, and that is something I want to be apart of.. But WAR BJ
by "Mr. NC-17" on Jan 28, 2009 10:27 PM EST up reply actions
Do you know what weight BJ walks around at? I can’t imagine him cutting from more than MAYBE 180 to hit 155, while GSP probably walks around at 200+. I know BJ’s fought heavier before, but… that plus the huge wrestling advantage = my GSP pick.
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:28 PM EST up reply actions
BJ probably is about 175 walking weight.
I see GSP being about 190-195.
I think GSP’s strength in wrestling and BJ’s cardio are going to be huge factors in this fight.
by "Mr. NC-17" on Jan 28, 2009 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
Which of those two factors leads to a BJ prediction? :-D
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
been said...
It has already been verified from the fighters themselves that BJ will be 170 give or take and GSP will be between 185-187 on fight night.
Now as long as they go into why BJ is a serious risk to GSP in the next segment, UFC Primetime will have achieved its goal.
I think they missed the mark, but damn they play some good music. Anyone no the song where they’re packing up and going to Las Vegas?
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jan 28, 2009 10:27 PM EST up reply actions
People in Planes – Last Man
Contributing writer for MMA-Analyst.com
by Joe Schmitt on Jan 28, 2009 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
This fight should be seen by everyone.
Not people who love the sport, not people with a TV. Everyone.
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:32 PM EST reply actions
Ah screw it, I want to see the fight even more now, so I it did its job. Well played UFC Primetime, well played.
I know that was hard
But I’m proud of you
by Derek Suboticki on Jan 28, 2009 10:33 PM EST up reply actions
Man, the last 3-4 minutes of that show as epic…I mean the music selection was dope….showing BJ Penn with his daughter laying in the crib as he was about to leave was just ill on so many levels…very well done.
http://mma4real.net/
I agree.
They some how found the perfect music for the situations.
by Cannon Jacques on Jan 28, 2009 10:35 PM EST up reply actions
that scene
and rashad walking in were the two coolest moments in the show in my opinion
im not impressed with your performance
Totally agree, and I hate rashad, but that music made him cool. haha. And the end was just, whew.
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jan 28, 2009 10:42 PM EST up reply actions
Rashad and GSP
Always rockin the suits and cool shit!
Me = GSP/Rashad nuthugger. I literally jumped up and yelled “Oh its on now bitches!!” when I saw him and his pimp walk to the sweet jam. My wife just rolled her eyes at me. :P
by xFenixKnightx on Jan 28, 2009 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
Pimp walk…so true…
I think he mastered the “cool but not arrogant black guy” thing. Also known as…
Pimpin’
lol
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jan 28, 2009 10:50 PM EST up reply actions
music
does anyone know the name of the song played at the end of the show. thanks
People in Planes – Last Man
Contributing writer for MMA-Analyst.com
by Joe Schmitt on Jan 28, 2009 11:47 PM EST up reply actions
I thought it was "Last Man Standing"
I am the bastard love child of Junie Browning and Diamond Dave Kaplan.
the end
When Penn got choked up talking about this at the end of the show, I felt a bit better about his chances
song
what was the name of the song at the end of the show
Here's an interesting question
How many people here think BJ Penn could beat Rashad Evans?
I think he could….
I also think Anderson would beat Rashad Evans but I think most people probably agree with that.
BJ & Anderson fighting would be a serious battle – they can both take hard blows and have crazy ground skills – if BJ wins Saturday – he has to fight Anderson – then Lyoto
"My job is a decision-making job, and as a result, I make a lot of decisions." --George W. Bush, The Decider, Lancaster, Pa., Oct. 3, 2007
by lovingmma25 on Jan 29, 2009 10:13 AM EST up reply actions
Anderson has waaaay to much length (w/ power) and natural size on BJ.
I am the bastard love child of Junie Browning and Diamond Dave Kaplan.
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