UFC: Primetime Has Failed to Portray BJ Penn as a Legitimate Threat
by Michael Rome on Jan 22, 2009 6:33 PM EST
in News
73 comments
I've really enjoyed both episodes of UFC: Primetime so far, but something is bothering me about the show. Going in, GSP was a clear favorite among the betting public, fans, and people in the business.
So far, the show has failed to portray BJ Penn as a serious threat. On the first episode, they got him over as the "bad guy" very well, and then ended with a cliffhanger about whether or not he was training hard enough. I figured the next episode would probably redeem him while showing GSP's weaknesses. Instead, it was the opposite. The second episode built GSP up even more by making it look like he has a much better training camp, much better coaches, and a much more serious approach to training. They made it look like Penn boxes with his brother while St. Pierre trains with the elite.
In the real world, BJ Penn is a dominant champion that won a world championship in jiu-jitsu, beat Matt Hughes when it really counted, and is considered by many to have the best hands in the sport. He's a very scary fighter, something you really wouldn't know by watching this show. The UFC famously convinced half of its audience that Tito Ortiz could beat Chuck Liddell in their rematch, but if you took that same internet poll this Saturday night it would overwhelmingly favor GSP. That is a failure of promotion.
The good news is it's not too late. They've done a good job setting the stage and presenting the characters, but it's time to remind fans why BJ Penn is by far the toughest test of GSP's career.
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QFT
I love both fighters though I will be rooting for GSP, but honestly I’m quite disgusted by how PENN is portrayed, BJ is a great champion, you don’t get their by slacking off in training, saying otherwise is degrading the UFC champ status, especially when it’s groundless. This is starting to look like GSP’s show featuring the bad guy BJ PENN.
I don’t care if it’s good drama or if it makes good TV, can’t we make an interesting AND legit SHOW? Can we save this show or is it too late?
Ps: Jackson’s camp looked badass -_-
by spectaa on Jan 22, 2009 6:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
GSP’s victory over him doesnt help very much in portraying Penn as a threat either.
by #5mmafan on Jan 22, 2009 6:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
but the fact that he absolutely mauled GSP in the first round and lost the fight on position, not damage, does.
by Kid Nate on Jan 22, 2009 7:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so you must be really looking forward to sylvia/nog 2
by #5mmafan on Jan 22, 2009 7:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am not impressed with your analogy!
lol.
If you're not submitting, you're just rolling around with another guy.
by BJJDenver on Jan 22, 2009 9:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am not impressed with what you did there!
by iiowyn on Jan 22, 2009 11:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
I can not agree more. I will be rooting on Penn (USA) but as always enjoy the matches for the plan and execution of both fighters. Although GSP has grown a ton since their first fight it was damn close and I argue Penn is an ideal lightweight and it impresses me how well he does in walter. The one thing Penn negates is GSP’s take down. GSP has the best shoot in MMA hands down but Penns gumby-like rubber bones and freak of nature balnace pretty much zero out even GSP’s ability to take him down.
Dana White does not like BJ and the marketing is just a reflection of that.
"You Went Full Retard, Man - Never Go Full Retard." --Kirk Lazarus
by Ovale Fan on Jan 22, 2009 6:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn’t agree with your last statement: I think Dana likes him just fine, he’s just frustrated with him. BJ is a difficult fighter: he leaves the ring without a real interview unless he has a fight to promote, his site gives him direct access to his fans so he doesn’t feel like he has to cooperate, he has a history of being willing to take the nuclear (leave the promotion) option if he doesn’t get his way….
I can understand Dana not liking that. Can’t you?
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
by jemaleddin on Jan 23, 2009 10:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I guess I am not sure what you expect from this.
BJ has talked a hell of a lot of trash, as has his team. As far as being “the bad guy” Penn is the one that is talking trash, what do you expect?
The reality is that Penn has a crew that work for him, while GSP has some of the best flying in for this bout. That footage is the only thing that made GSP look stronger, in my opinion.
I think the show did a fine job with each guy. They have added dimensions to both. The footage of Penn and his family was great and showed me a side of BJ I have never seen.
For those blaming the show to making BJ look a certain way: What has been false? BJ did take five days off and he has a history of slacking off before fights. He once talked about surfing as helping his conditioning.
Ovale,
BJ and Dana get along very well these days. White has spent time with him in the islands.
You also said that Penn can “zero out even GSP’s ability to take him down.”
GSP managed more then one TD in their first bout.
by Lynchman on Jan 22, 2009 7:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
When they built Tito and Chuck, they ran a countdown show that made everyone think he had the best chance of anyone to beat Chuck. That was a joke, realistically speaking. It did huge business.
There is so much they could do to highlight Penn’s danger. His brutal wins, the fact that Freddie Roach says he’s the best boxer in all of MMA, his world championship in jiu jitsu. Instead he’s some lazy jackass who trains with his family and goes on vacation. It’s terrible fight promotion.
by Michael Rome on Jan 22, 2009 7:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The show isn’t an A&E Biography. It’s a documentary about their training leading up to this fight. If Penn is portrayed as a “lazy jackass who trains with his family and goes on vacation” it’s his own fault for being a lazy jackass who trains with his family and goes on vacation when the cameras are rolling.
by George Lucas on Jan 22, 2009 7:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Jackass
I laughed t this because BJ does seem to be the cocky jackass you want to see beat up. And even though I’ll root for Penn, GSP has always conducted himself as a professional and with a lot of class imo. BTW, I would be happy if my garbage man could keep my can up righted after he empties it much less work 16 hour shifts. I’ll go out on a limb and say sanitation is not union up there in Canada!
"You Went Full Retard, Man - Never Go Full Retard." --Kirk Lazarus
by Ovale Fan on Jan 22, 2009 7:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not really, there’s a reason they showed the fight from a few years ago, talk about both their childhoods, etc. 24/7 focused on history as well. It’s a mix of documentary of training and their history as fighters and who they are as people.
by Michael Rome on Jan 22, 2009 7:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Sure. They do all of that in the context of a show about training for a fight that BJ doesn’t apparently feel like training for.
by George Lucas on Jan 22, 2009 7:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you are missing the point
What they are doing with Primetime is classic promotion – not a failure at all. And their ratings are proving that. They are creating a hero and a villain. I think the average person that doesn’t know much about GSP or BJ Penn before watching Primetime may be interested in buying the PPV not just to see GSP win but because they want to see BJ Penn lose. The usual ~300 thousand or so MMA fans that buy every UFC PPV will buy this UFC PPV with or without the Primetime show. I think they are trying to draw more casual MMA fans or pro wrestling fans that are used to buying a spectacle based on a hero vs. villain type storyline.
You have to remember this is PPV and PPV sells based on the allure of spectacle more so than a desire to see true athletic competition. Most casual fans of MMA don’t understand the intricacies or even many generalities of MMA, they just want to see a cool fight card.
I also think that the Primetime crew might not be convinced that BJ is really is preparing the way he should for such a major fight. If it is the same crew that did the RJJ 24/7 and Pacquiao/DLH 24/7 shows they know how professional fighters prepare themselves in the weeks leading up to the fight. I am getting the impression they are comfortable with GSP’s approach but seem put off by BJ’s antics.
by Daniel Humire on Jan 22, 2009 11:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I believe I said negate not zero...
I do believe the shoot will be less effective against Penn then say…laying on Kos for 15 minutes not allowing him to do a thing. And trust me GSP’s shoot is heads and tails above what is was on their first bout but you can not simulate Penns take down defense so it’s tough to train for. Just so were on the same page I said I’m rooting for Penn, GSP is a clear favorite and everyone knows it.
BTW if your talking about Dana Whites November trip it was primarily marketing for the UFC. GSP was also there and I doubt they all went clubbing as BFF’s.
"You Went Full Retard, Man - Never Go Full Retard." --Kirk Lazarus
by Ovale Fan on Jan 22, 2009 7:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I cut and pasted your words, zero was indeed your word.
I am not talking about the P.R. trip. Since Penn came back to the UFC, Dana has spent time with BJ. He and BJ get along pretty well, he is one of the fighters that White genuinely likes.
by Lynchman on Jan 22, 2009 7:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You cut and pasted SOME of my words
“GSP has the best shoot in MMA hands down but Penns gumby-like rubber bones and freak of nature balnace pretty much zero out even GSP’s ability to take him down.”
If you read between the lines you can conclude out that I believe Penn will make the shoot tough. Although it was not a good choice of words that would be like saying almost or pretty empty is the same as empty.
"You Went Full Retard, Man - Never Go Full Retard." --Kirk Lazarus
by Ovale Fan on Jan 22, 2009 7:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Since Roach is working with AA, they are not going to go ask him for footage.
A couple of things:
A) Ortiz was coming off two very high profile wins over Shamrock, as well as one over Forrest. Die hard fans knew the Shamrock wins were a joke, but casual fans did not know that.
B) GSP’s trainers and crew talked pretty much just about GSP and his skills. BJ and his people spent the time also talking about GSP. That is going to keep the focus on GSP. Penn’s crew should have been hyping Penn quite a bit and told America why Penn is an icon.
by Lynchman on Jan 22, 2009 7:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Excellent Point
“B) GSP’s trainers and crew talked pretty much just about GSP and his skills. BJ and his people spent the time also talking about GSP. That is going to keep the focus on GSP. Penn’s crew should have been hyping Penn quite a bit and told America why Penn is an icon.”
I guess I should not relieve the camps from the responsibility to marketing themselves.
"You Went Full Retard, Man - Never Go Full Retard." --Kirk Lazarus
by Ovale Fan on Jan 22, 2009 8:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I hadn’t really thought about it until you mentioned it, but you could be on to something. Hopefully you’re right and they’re able to rectify the situation in the next episode.
by Rundownloser on Jan 22, 2009 7:27 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
and is considered by many to have the best hands in the sport.
What
by George Lucas on Jan 22, 2009 7:34 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
This isn’t exactly a radical position. He’s probably the best boxer in the sport. There are a number of world famous boxing coaches that have echoed a similar belief, including Freddie Roach.
by Michael Rome on Jan 22, 2009 7:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so you think BJ would beat Marcus Davis in a pure boxing match?
by #5mmafan on Jan 22, 2009 7:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course it’s a misleading question. BJ’s effective boxing includes the threat of his takedown and fear of the rest of his game. Marcus has over 20 pro boxing fights. I think if they had an MMA fight, BJ would get the better of the standing game.
by Michael Rome on Jan 22, 2009 7:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hes a good boxer, very akward punching style and great with angles, reminds me of james toney, but his boxing only appears to be so elite because opponents would rather deal with it than his ground game.
by #5mmafan on Jan 22, 2009 7:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He looks elite against grapplers with short arms.
by George Lucas on Jan 22, 2009 7:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well I wasn’t really impressed by Davis’ Machidaness on Sat. Actually, it kinda pissed me off. BJ would own him.
by xFenixKnightx on Jan 22, 2009 8:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think Marcus Davis is best boxer in the sport either.
by George Lucas on Jan 22, 2009 8:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
LMAO
LMAO James Toney what the fuck are you talking about
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Jan 23, 2009 2:35 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i guess you dont watching boxing very much, they throw almost an identical lunging jab, and their defensive sytyle is very similiar, relying on just slight movements, they stand and lean forward in the same way. not to mention they both are insanely talented and ridiculously lazy and love to fight bigger men and have some of the biggest nuts in their respective sports.
by #5mmafan on Jan 23, 2009 4:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Considering BJ actually jabs
maybe
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Jan 23, 2009 2:34 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It’s pretty radical to say that a fighter who’s never knocked anyone out and got outpointed on the feet by Jens Pulver is the best boxer in the sport.
by George Lucas on Jan 22, 2009 7:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He didn’t knock Caol Uno and Din Thomas out?
by smoogy on Jan 22, 2009 8:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think he meant with a punch
So Thomas and Sherk are out but yes he did KO Uno – then got held to a draw by him
WAR UNO
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Jan 23, 2009 2:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The problem is that the stand-up in MMA is more than just hands.
I can see two issues with BJ’s stand-up:
A) He relies on his jab too much. While it is powerful, he should use more combos.
B) Lack of kicks. I have no doubt we will see GSP keep his distance and work kicks to the body and legs of Penn. If he started to mix kicks into his combos, he could be even more dangerous.
by Lynchman on Jan 22, 2009 8:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
wowzers
This is literally the first time I have heard someone say a fighter relies on his jab too much; usually it’s just the opposite. If it aint broke don’t fix it. I mention this because you say “issues with BJ’s stand-up”
by MauiPimpin on Jan 22, 2009 8:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It may work for him, but his stand-up is hardly the best in MMA.
He may have “the best boxing” but certainly not the best stand-up.
by Lynchman on Jan 22, 2009 8:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so....
if he was to not jab as much and throw more kicks, regardless of the fact that he doesn’t need to do those things to win, you would consider him a better stand up fighter than you do now? I’m seriously just trying to understand your logic, I’m not trying to be a dick.
by MauiPimpin on Jan 22, 2009 8:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
BJ can do whatever he wants, but I am saying that there are plenty of fighters that have a better stand-up game than he does.
I simply pointed out the obvious limitations of his stand-up game.
It does not mean he has to change, I am simply saying his stand-up is hardly the best.
I am really interested in seeing how Penn’s stand-up works against GSP, a man that will almost certain stay at the edge of Penn’s range and offer up a liberal use of leg and body kicks.
The jab was great with the reach advantage he had over Sherk and against Stevenson (with his limited striking skills), but against good strikers, it may not be enough.
by Lynchman on Jan 22, 2009 9:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I figured that GSP wants to stay on the outside with kicks and get BJ to come after him. Once BJ does that, GSP changes levels and takes BJ down and precedes to ground and pound. I think that would be a workable plan for him.
by Rundownloser on Jan 22, 2009 9:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lynchman I feel like you have successfuly made the BE population dumber have reading your posts. You are relating BJ’s standup to Muy Thai. In a Muy Thai fight, you are right…. he doesn’t throw enough kicks…. but this is MMA. The jab is the most underused weapon in MMA and inarguably the most effective weapon in a standup game. It is your jab that can establish rhythm and open up combinations. It just happens that BJ’s jab is so stiff that he’s usually able to knock people down with it… but I think BJ is definitely in the top 5 standup in mma. Another key factor in standup is the ability to take a punch and we know that BJ can do that. St. Pierre vs. Serra 1????
by adamdd on Jan 23, 2009 9:14 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If BJ got hit in the same place as Serra hit GSP, he would have been on queer street as well. Getting hit behind the ear has nothing to do with a fighter’s “chin”, which BJ has an awesome one.
by iiowyn on Jan 23, 2009 11:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
BJ is “usually able to knock people down” with his jab?
Can you provide this extensive list of examples where he knocked people down with his jab?
by Hardcharger on Jan 23, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just to clarify what I meant, and after reading I see I wrote it wrong… he’s got the ability to “rock” someone with a jab. He can stun people with his jab and use that to set up his takedowns or combinations.
by adamdd on Jan 23, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
thats true, many who know nothing do consider him to have the best hands in the sport
by #5mmafan on Jan 22, 2009 7:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
“They made it look like Penn boxes with his brother while St. Pierre trains with the elite.”
They did not mention anyone else that BJ Penn is sparring with in preparation, so what would make people think that BJ is sparring with elite fighters?
I am pretty sure if he was training with more people than just his trainers and brother, they would mention them.
He is the top dog in his camp, if he was in a situation like GSP where he is consistently being challenged by champions of different SPORTS much less in MMA.
It could be all one sided on purpose, maybe the UFC assumed people would overwhelmingly assume BJ would dominate this fight.
by DirtyML on Jan 22, 2009 7:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
“He is the top dog in his camp, if he was in a situation like GSP where he is consistently being challenged by champions of different SPORTS much less in MMA.”..
Didn’t really finish, “… it would help diversify BJ’s game and really help him grow as a professional to not be the guy who is #1 in his camp and everyone else is attending to him. But if he was apart of a camp where other peoples success mattered just as much and he was not the top dog, I think he would learn a lot, and be a better fighter for it.”
by DirtyML on Jan 22, 2009 7:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think his personality would actually be a barrier
to his successful inclusion in a ‘pack-oriented’ camp. He likes being the Big Dog, and while I personally despise the guy, there’s no arguing with success. The guy is the Big Dog.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on Jan 22, 2009 9:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
GSP might have something to say about that come UFC 94 =D
by iiowyn on Jan 22, 2009 11:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Here’s hoping you’re right.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on Jan 23, 2009 11:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This issue may simply come down to BJ being more charasmatic and interesting on camera than GSP. GSP is a very likeable guy but he tends to rely upon rehearsed lines (when you play card you don show yo hand) that make him sound a stiff.
At the same time, GSP’s training sessions are far more exciting than BJ, which are typically him simply hitting pads and sparring.
The result – we hear BJ talk and see GSP train.
by MMAEruption on Jan 22, 2009 7:45 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think GSP uses rehearsed line, I think it is more a matter of English not being his first language. He often seems to take a moment to say what he means.
But Penn is far better at hype and promotion.
by Lynchman on Jan 22, 2009 8:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Regardless of the documentary however, I think Penn winning is just bad for the UFC in general, unless he abandons one of the belts, that means both belts might get defended once a year, with one being defended twice depending on the more attractive match-ups.
I respect him wanting to be a champion in two weight classes, but one weight class is going to have only 1 #1 contender per year and that is just bad for the fans.
by DirtyML on Jan 22, 2009 7:49 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I’d actually be surprised if BJ kept the lightweight title. At the UFC 84 press conference he didn’t express any interest in fighting the winner of Florian/Huerta and he already beat Sherk, the best besides him.
by MMAEruption on Jan 22, 2009 7:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Overlooking Florian would be a very foolish move. Kenny’s stand-up is more diverse than that of Penn and his BJJ is top notch.
Penn would certainly be a favorite (And rightly so), but Florian has the tools to win if Penn did not focus on that fight. It took Florian far less time to finish off Stevenson. Since his loss to Sherk, nobody has even looked competitive against Florian.
by Lynchman on Jan 22, 2009 8:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Kenny’s stand-up is def more diverse but BJ has a hell of a lot more power and a phenomenal chin. BJ is way better on the ground as well.
by MMAEruption on Jan 22, 2009 8:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, Penn > Florian
in pretty much every way imaginable. Not saying it wouldn’t be an entertaining fight, but it might end up looking like GSP vs. Fitch. Totally one-sided.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on Jan 22, 2009 9:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't it accurate though
Despite being a great fighter Penn is a little bit cocky and he doesn’t sort out the most elite trainers he can find to train him.
Think about how much better Penn would be if he trained with the US Olympic Wrestling team and trained his jits everyday with Marcelo Garcia. I know Penn’s BJJ is top notch but you can always improve.
Penn’s biggest barrier to greatness is still himself.
by rainmaker6 on Jan 22, 2009 8:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Confused by this post.
So, the producers are supposed to casually not mention that GSP is training with obvious high profile fighters like Marquadt and Jardine just because BJ isn’t doing something similar?
Seems to me the fighters are being portrayed pretty accurately.
BJ wants to be a cocky douche, and it’s working.
GSP is acting like the humble athlete, and it’s working.
by nastyemu25 on Jan 22, 2009 9:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I seem to be the only one that doesn’t seem that BJ is coming off as some sort of douche bag. Sure he’s cocky and confident but if he wasn’t what the hell is he doing fighting? Everyone trains differently and taking time to recover your body before going into your final stretch is not unheard of at all. I don’t think this is nearly as big a deal as the blogosphere is making this out to be.
GSP certainly had Team Nipple Tweak there with him but Greg Jackson is noticeably absent from the show so far. While he has a team to run in NM I believe previously GSP finished his training down there. While GSP’s athleticism is undeniable he has never blown me away with what he has been able to do to his opponents. His style at times has seemed odd for MMA, esp with his striking.
Penn will be giving up weight, wrestling, and overall athleticism to GSP in the fight. GSP does not have the same accuracy and hand speed that BJ has and unless GSP has figured out how to use his legs like arms he will lose the BJJ battle all day long too. This is a very evenly matched fight which personally I can’t wait for.
by Shack on Jan 22, 2009 9:22 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
The problem is the show is portraying the reality :)
BJ is a level 10 fighter with level 6 training camps…
GSP is a level 9 fighter with level 10 training camps…
Can BJ be hyped up more? sure… I agree on this point.
But every portrayal so far is pretty accurate.
The common consensus is as the fight goes on GSP will get stronger and BJ will get weaker.
Sure he looked good against sherk, but he wasnt being pushed the way GSP will be pushing.
When the fight starts GSP will have a strength advantage and the longer the fight goes that advantage will increase.
When the fight starts BJ will have the technique advantage and the longer the fight goes that advantage will decrease.
GSP is the favorite and if he beats BJ and Thiago he will have a super fight with anderson.
by mmalogic on Jan 23, 2009 6:43 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
The show obviously can portray reality. Here’s some reality: Penn’s jits is way better than GSP’s. His straight boxing is better, and Freddie Roach thinks he’s the best boxer in MMA. He’s one of the hardest guys to take down in the game when he’s fresh. Randy Couture and Matt Lindland rave about his wrestling and had nightmares trying to take him down.
When they promote Thiago-GSP, they will make it look like Thiago is a complete monster and a real threat. Watching this you’d think BJ is nothing. It’s not that I care about what is fair to him, but they are taking an underdog and making him more of an underdog. This is the same promotion that gave people the impression Gracie could beat Hughes. They are not getting the return on their money they should be.
by Michael Rome on Jan 23, 2009 4:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So how should the show those traits (true to the extent you say they are, or not) on the show?
The showed GSP’s face from the first fight, showing clips of Penn busting him up. They’ve talked about his BJJ. Freddie Roach’s opinion on MMA striking is irrelevant, because this isn’t pure boxing. Couture and Lindland have praised BJ’s wrestling, but GSP got him on 4 of 5 TD attempts. Hughes got him down.
If Penn had a team of monsters in his camp, they’d show clips of that. Where are those guys? If Penn did an actual S&C program, they’d show that. He doesn’t do one. Whenever he’s interviewed, BJ talks about GSP. And there’s still wonder why the focus is on GSP?
by Hardcharger on Jan 23, 2009 4:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It’s extraordinarily easy. You have Freddie Roach come on screen, and say BJ Penn is the best boxer he’s seen in this sport. You can show a quick clip of his world championship while the narrator talks about his unparalleled skill in jiu jitsu. You can have numerous fighters comment on it. You can interview guys he’s fought.
There’s a lot they can do. This isn’t a pure real time show. They went back and went over both of their childhoods, the first fight, etc. The idea that these shows should be all about training or can only focus on camps is ridiculous.
by Michael Rome on Jan 23, 2009 5:41 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
here is the quote from Iole
"I talked to Freddie Roach about B.J. last week and he told me by far…he said by far, B.J. Penn is the best striker he’s ever seen among MMA fighters and he thinks that if B.J. can get into a striking match with GSP, he would definitely win that.
i only post this because ive seen this quote used in refrence to bj being called a great boxer. roach never said boxer he used the term striker. as for that claim, i would disagree.
by #5mmafan on Jan 23, 2009 6:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There are other Roach quotes in the past too from when they worked together, though I haven’t been able to find them again.
Freddie Roach is a boxing coacher. What do you think he’s talking about? Muay thai knees? Obviously he means boxing.
by Michael Rome on Jan 23, 2009 7:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
to be honest, after reading what Roach has said about the Fedor/AA fight, i don’t know what he’s talking about
by #5mmafan on Jan 23, 2009 7:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
GSP is a level 9 10 fighter with level 10 11 training camps…
Fixed!
You’re welcome :)
by xFenixKnightx on Jan 23, 2009 8:34 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
LOL at this entire premise and the whining about BJ not being promoted more.
This show is a vehicle to promote BJ Penn. All he does is talk trash in every interview about how he’s going to kill GSP.
Are the producers supposed to invent an elite training camp for Penn? Not show the footage of him taking a 5 day vacation just weeks away from the fight?
Should they ignore GSP’s murder’s row of a training camp? Ignore GSP’s incredible work ethic and the single-mindedness of everyone in his camp?
Give me a break. Penn comes off as Penn is – a guy who loves to talk a lot and hasn’t trained like a champ for much of his career. He used the first 5 minutes of Ep 2 to try and paint himself in a better light, rather than letting the footage of him busting his @ss in the gym do the talking for him.
by Hardcharger on Jan 23, 2009 9:52 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
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