Brock Lesnar, Randy Couture on ESPN
by Luke Thomas
on Sep 3, 2008 3:51 PM EDT
in News
I can't believe people attacked me for suggesting Affliction likely had very little chance of succeeding in the face of the UFC machine and reach. What were you thinking?
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Come on Luke, many of the Affliction fans still think Affliction is gonna be a long term success and defeat the UFC. It was never about business sense or realism. Its about hope, however irrational.
by Michaelthebox on Sep 3, 2008 4:34 PM EDT 0 recs
So either you think Affliction is doomed or you think it will defeat the UFC, with no in between?
I don’t think its unreasonable to judge Affliction on its own merits instead of crowing about how they are finished every time UFC books a fight or makes an announcement. Lesnar vs. Couture is a big fight, but so is Arlovski vs. Barnett
by smoogy on
Sep 3, 2008 4:45 PM EDT
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I didn’t say we can’t judge Affliction on its own merits. But a huge percentage of fans were not; they were pinning their hopes and wishes on Affliction.
I don’t see Affliction surviving, but I see that in terms of their overall business plan and the state of the market, and have seen it that way basically since June. But a very healthy percentage of people fully expected Affliction to be a huge success based on very little. Some because they wanted an alternative to the UFC. Some because they wanted the UFC beaten. And some just because they wanted a more boxing-style model of promotion.
But those were wants and hopes and wishes, and wants and hopes and wishes don’t care about reason or rationale or the fact that the signs were not and have never been very good for Affliction.
by Michaelthebox on
Sep 3, 2008 4:52 PM EDT
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I don’t crow every time the UFC books a fight. My point from the beginning is that no organization can remain competitive to the UFC or perhaps even fiscally solvent going head-to-head with them. When I affirmed that point after their first event, I was screamed at for the mere suggestion that Affliction’s chances at even short run survival were bleak.
As for “judging Affliction on it’s own terms”, that is precisely what we are doing. I interviewed Michael Cohen myself and he was clear that Affliction’s goal was to compete on the national and international stage of MMA. Judging them, then, for their fiscal solvency in MMA endeavors and ability to last as a business entity long term are perfectly valid. Thus far, all signs point toward Affliction merely marking their time.
The video above is an illustration of the power and reach of the UFC machine. They are not only able to make large fights happen, they are able to do so while making money, cultural imprints, reasserting their preeminence among competitors and garnering meaningful media attention. Not one other MMA organization on the national stage besides the UFC has been able to do that at all much less consistently.
by Luke Thomas on
Sep 3, 2008 4:57 PM EDT
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I remember that article after the first show…
Unfortunately It was filled with common sense and logic… thus the back lash.
I just saw a headline in the midst of all this from a site purporting to try explain the business side of MMA:
“No Need To Panic: An Analysis of the MMA Industry”
Who’s panicking? The potentially biggest fight in the industry is about to take place…
And people crying about this fight should realize it is a heck of alot more competitive than lidell-ortiz 2 which to date is the biggest fight.
Here’s the only analysis one needs in order to understand this industry:
UFC is the wave not MMA.
Ride the wave and probability is on your side.
Try to take on the wave and you will be crushed.
Period.
by mmalogic on
Sep 3, 2008 5:19 PM EDT
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There is a big difference though...
between Lesnar vs. Couture which is a HUGE fight for not only hardcore MMA fans and Arlovski vs. Barnett which is one guy with a good rep for the casuals (Arlovski) and a guy who doesn’t carry a ton of credit with anyone but the hardcores.
That isn’t to take anything away from either fighter….and I am genuinely excited about the fight. Arlovski is a hell of a guy (I’ve met him a few times when I was living in the Chicagoland area) and one of my favorite fighters to watch. But you can’t compare those two fights and consider them on the same level except when it comes to straight hardcore MMA fans.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on
Sep 3, 2008 7:18 PM EDT
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I agree. Thinking that Affliction is poised for long term success is very much irrational.
Almost as irrational as thinking Lesnar vs. Couture says anything about the long term viability of UFC’s heavyweight division.
by George Lucas on
Sep 3, 2008 6:38 PM EDT
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Dude...
we get it….you don’t like the Lesnar/Couture matchmaking (and seem to be quite firmly in the anti-UFC camp) but you’re killing your own ability to make you points when you won’t make points beyond very surface level “old guy vs. unproven = bad”
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on
Sep 3, 2008 7:21 PM EDT
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That’s the only point that needs to be made. There’s so much UFC cheerleading and talking about how this is totally going to change things for UFC’s heavyweight division when in reality this is a one-off freakshow that succeeds in burying Couture/Fedor even better than 9 months litigation did.
What makes you (or anyone else) think that this is going to be a good fight?
by George Lucas on
Sep 3, 2008 7:27 PM EDT
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This is going to help the UFC’s HW division by creating hype, something that they have been severely lacking since Randy’s “resignation.”
Who knows if Brock/Randy is going to be good, it’s going to be huge, it’s going to get a bunch of buys, and it’s going to make everyone involved a lot of money. It’s going to generate hype for the Mir/Nog fight, and it’s going to help them because towards the end of TUF they will mention 5 times an episode how the winner gets a shot at Brock or Randy.
This is making 3 huge HW matches for the UFC, which is 3 more than they’ve had in a while.
by Phildo on
Sep 3, 2008 7:32 PM EDT
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I think it will be a good fight...
because of the feeling I’ll likely have while watching it. That tense “anything can happen” unknown quality will make it a very interesting experience. It will also have an insane atmosphere and bring a lot of attention to the sport.
This would NOT have happened with Fedor/Couture. That would have been a big fight but you’re kidding yourself if you think that outside of the hardcores it would be a bigger fight than Lesnar/Couture.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on
Sep 3, 2008 7:33 PM EDT
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Here’s a question for you George…
would you rather have couture sit out and fight the winner of nog/mir?
no matter how you dice it… this is huge.
By just having Randy this causes a ripple effect of untold bounty.
From a hardcore point of view:
Couture vs Lesnar is more competitive than lidell vs ortiz 2 was.
This is so far from a freakshow it’s not even funny. If Lesnar didn’t have the performance he did with heath than yes you may have a vine to climb on but come on MAN.
And Couture vs nog or Lesnar vs Nog will be great.
by mmalogic on
Sep 3, 2008 7:43 PM EDT
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It says a ton
If Lesnar beats Couture, then Mir/Nog. then all the sarcasm and trolling in the world won’t let you deny the fact that he would easily be a top 10 HW. And if Randy beats Brock, well, we’re back to whether or not Lesnar belongs in MMA and Randy becomes even bigger than he is and sets up two more huge fights with Nog/Mir or Fedor.
by LiuLang on
Sep 3, 2008 7:22 PM EDT
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You keep complaining about the UFC’s hw division. They have Big Nog, Randy Couture (who everybody wanted, so much so they were trying to help him win his court case and trying to use his face) Lesnar, Velasquez, Werdum, Mir, Gonzaga, Kongo, Herring, O’Brien, Carwin (several of these are up and coming and therefore tomorrows stars instead of just todays headliners) and enough money to pay them all and then some. What other company has this many of the top HW’s and the $$$ to pay them all while making some cake themselves? Are you the guy with glasses running Affliction?
by Tommy7 on
Sep 3, 2008 7:51 PM EDT
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Carwin, O’Brien, Velasquez, Herring, Mir and (wait for it) Lesnar aren’t top heavyweights.
Heavyweight divisions suck universally throughout the MMA world. It’s just sad that the biggest, richest and best managed MMA promotion on the planet can’t put together a heavyweight division worth a damn.
by George Lucas on
Sep 3, 2008 9:29 PM EDT
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Umm..that’s where up and coming came from. You must build for tomorrow while living today. Mir and Herring have both done their share of fighting to be considered. I love critics like you, you sit back and talk down everyone but bring nothing of your own to the table. You sound bitter like your maybe Mark Cuban or something.
by Tommy7 on
Sep 3, 2008 10:37 PM EDT
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Lesnar looks like a caricature there, in a suit, the size difference of him vs the interviewer is staggering.
by pr0cs on Sep 3, 2008 4:42 PM EDT 0 recs
His head has always looked kind of inhuman to me. Like he’s some statue and the sculptor didn’t bother shaping his head more than a cube with facial features on the front.
by Michaelthebox on
Sep 3, 2008 5:04 PM EDT
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He'd probably laugh.
He’s always making jokes about his head, on all the WWF/E promos they did with him, he would take an opportunity to crack wise about his dome.
Even in the Herring pre-fight hype stuff he liked his head to a ball-peen hammer.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on
Sep 4, 2008 6:04 AM EDT
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I'm Confused?
So what are we supposed to be rooting for here? Today is the goal for all MMA to die off except for the UFC? Then I can just tune in and let Dana White tell me what I like and don’t like about MMA.
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
by aaronb on Sep 3, 2008 5:31 PM EDT 0 recs
When has that ever been a risk? The UFC has to please both casual fans and hardcore fans, and those conflicting needs keep the UFC honest. Even if they are the only MMA organization in the world, if they provide a crappy product, the casuals will watch American Idol instead.
by Michaelthebox on
Sep 3, 2008 5:45 PM EDT
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They can’t afford to put on a crappy product even once they’re the only MMA org left standing because they still have to compete for overall entertainment dollars.
by Richard on
Sep 3, 2008 6:15 PM EDT
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Exactly. Never understood the “monopoly” fears, as a crappy UFC is easily replaced by boxing or kickboxing or racing or a dozen other sports. Or an evening at the movies.
by Michaelthebox on
Sep 3, 2008 6:20 PM EDT
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Remember the run poker had
after the NHL hold-out?
Entertainment dollars will be spent. If your product is good, you will keep your market share. If your product is bad, but there’s a big vacuum, you’ll get tons of business short-term. It’s simple free-market mechanics. But the one constant is that people will continue to spend a given percentage of their income (gross, usually..entertainment is pretty recession-proof) on personal entertainment.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on
Sep 4, 2008 6:07 AM EDT
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Here’s the problem.
You don’t have to be rooting against Affliction to come out and say that they are going to fail. It’s perfectly reasonable to come out and say that their business model is not working and that, as things stand right now, they don’t really have a chance to compete at the level they are looking to compete at without hoping they fail.
by Phildo on
Sep 3, 2008 6:58 PM EDT
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Exactly!
I loved PRIDE to my very core…but that doesn’t mean that toward the end I was saying “jesus…this is getting REALLY bad.”
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on
Sep 3, 2008 7:22 PM EDT
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This is a win-win situation for Brock….this was a horrible fight for Randy to take, it is a must win for him or career over…
by l2ufi0 on Sep 3, 2008 5:44 PM EDT 0 recs
Definitely not true. He will make more money in 1 fight than he did in almost all his priors combined, and they have a line of fights planned out for him back at LHW if he loses. He will be fine.
by Michael Rome on
Sep 3, 2008 5:51 PM EDT
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So you believe Couture is far and away the best paid guy in the sport now?
by Tommy7 on
Sep 3, 2008 6:09 PM EDT
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"Far and away"?
Maybe, maybe not. But one of the top guys in terms of compensation for sure. I’m quite confident Dana made it worth his while.
by Luke Thomas on
Sep 3, 2008 6:13 PM EDT
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Me too. Randy wasn’t coming back for less then millions. Over 3 fights I can see him clearing 6-7 million. That’s if he keeps his stock up though.
by Tommy7 on
Sep 3, 2008 8:02 PM EDT
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Under his old deal, a million buys would have netted him $2,672,000. He’s doing better now. So assume, as I think we can, that he ends up making a cool 3-4 off of this fight. Has he made that much fighting in his whole career prior to this just counting purse money? it’s probably close.
by Michael Rome on
Sep 3, 2008 8:35 PM EDT
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I didn’t realize he made that much. That’s in line with what Liddell makes. I remember back when he signed to fight Tim they said his contract was among the best in the company. Second to only people such as Chuck.
by Tommy7 on
Sep 3, 2008 9:02 PM EDT
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chuck lidell made more than 10 million dollars in one year… and this was before elite xc or affliction were around.
Do you hear this on anywhere? no…
But you hear tito ortiz signs a record breaking deal which was utter bullshit.
Nobody talks about reality, instead people are dying to find zuffa lacking in some way.
by mmalogic on
Sep 3, 2008 11:43 PM EDT
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Yes I’m sure 45 year old Randy Couture, who hasn’t fought in a year because he wanted to fight Fedor and retire, has a long list of fights after Lesnar.
by George Lucas on
Sep 3, 2008 6:36 PM EDT
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As always, George Lucas, I love your sarcasm...
The problem is that the UFC unleashed Lesnar at the perfect time. No “real” fan believes that the winner of Fedor/Couture is the best fighter in the world now that Lesnar is off the chain. If Randy wanted to retire after beating the best, a win over Fedor wouldn’t help that. If Randy wanted to make a quick buck off Fedor, it’s too late, Tim Silvia already did that. Couture has no options now, except to fight lesnar. In other words, Don’t Mess With Zuffa… You Can’t Win!
I told you I can't build your candy house! It will fall apart, the sun will melt the candy, it won't work!
by mma_dude on
Sep 3, 2008 6:46 PM EDT
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Standard, nonproductive snark.
Helping remind me I’m on the internet. Thanks GL.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on
Sep 4, 2008 6:09 AM EDT
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I think a lot of people had high hopes for Affliction (including myself), but once a business plan was revealed, with all those high purses and unrealistic PPV goals, compared to the current MMA landscape and economic status, I think anyone with any common sense figured Affliction’s days were numbered. Their plans, while idealistic, were far-fetched at best, or just plain unrealistic, to be kind.
On a similar vein, I don’t think anyone realistically wants a UFC dominated MMA scene. Monopolies, no matter what industry, are not good for consumers, nor for the industry itself. Competition breeds better products and helps the industry to evolve. If anything, this past summer has forced Zuffa to really flex its muscles, and it was clear: the product produced was heads and shoulders above the rest, and above all, it kept Zuffa honest. I think those that still believe Affliction will be around for the long run are just kidding themselves at this point.
by pud333 on Sep 3, 2008 6:17 PM EDT 0 recs
Hell, I do. As I mentioned earlier, the UFC can never be a true monopoly due to competition with other sports and forms of entertainment. Also, while having two or three powerful leagues would be good, the more leagues the higher the likelihood of the promotional game devolving to what boxing has. Which sucks on wheels.
by Michaelthebox on
Sep 3, 2008 6:22 PM EDT
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What?????
So you would rather have
A) A strong UFC with no competitors
or
B) Screw it, I’ll go watch NASCAR
How can anyone argue with a staight face that competition this year hasn’t brought on loads of good events? Just the jump in free events alone has really upped the ante for all MMA. Anyone who thinks this is a bad thing has to have some sort of financial stake in the UFC.
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
by aaronb on
Sep 3, 2008 7:01 PM EDT
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But these good events could have been happening all the time if all the fighters were in one place.
Name one big fight that we’ve missed out on since the death of Pride that doesn’t involve Fedor?
What great matchups is the UFC not givin us that they can?
by Phildo on
Sep 3, 2008 7:03 PM EDT
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They have to give us good matchups
Because there is competition for the MMA dollar. If they cared about making the top matches then they would cross promote. They wouldnt bury guys who are 1 fight from FA. They wouldnt bash everything Non Zuffa. True they have been putting on good fights from the company roster. But so does everyone else. Does everyone forget that it hasnt been that long ago where we got Evans/Bisping, Franklin/Shamrock, Ortiz/Shamrock, Stevenson/Penn as main event fodder?
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
by aaronb on
Sep 3, 2008 7:13 PM EDT
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Dude, you think the UFC is giving us these great fights because of their competition? They aren’t. The UFC has NO competition for the MMA dollar right now. The risks of EliteXC and Affliction aren’t that they will take away the dollars right now, they are that they will grow into being decent promotions that will compete in the future. But that has very little to do with the UFC’s matchmaking today.
The plain fact is that I crave MMA and will accept a substandard product if I have no alternatives, and so will most of the other fans who post online and write blogs and breathe MMA. But the UFC makes most of its money from people who would drop the UFC and the sport like a bad habit if it starts to suck. The UFC isn’t putting together great matches now because of competition. Its putting great matches together now because it wants to build its fanbase and increase the number of people who want to see its shows, and because the UFC now actually has the financial ability, reach, and technical prowess to do things now that it could not do in the past. That will not change, regardless of the number of upstart promotions that want to take a bite of the market.
by Michaelthebox on
Sep 3, 2008 7:25 PM EDT
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There isn’t so much an “MMA dollar” as there is an “entertainment dollar” and the UFC even if they become the only MMA game in town will still have to compete for that “entertainment dollar.” They can’t do that without putting on compelling matchups.
by Richard on
Sep 3, 2008 9:59 PM EDT
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The boxing promotional model sucks, and it’s corrupt beyond belief. That would definitely be bad for MMA. What I’m suggesting is a little competition, with someone nipping at Zuffa’s heels isn’t a bad thing. I think there’s room for a top dog like the UFC, with smaller promotions. Plus, I really do think the UFC can become a monopoly in MMA. Not necessarily in entertainment sports, but in MMA for sure. The same way the NFL or NHL is in their respective sports.
by pud333 on
Sep 3, 2008 10:29 PM EDT
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I think they boosted Randy’s seat all the way up and pushed Lesnar’s seat all the way down. And still Lesnar looks twice as big.
I told you I can't build your candy house! It will fall apart, the sun will melt the candy, it won't work!
by mma_dude on Sep 3, 2008 6:28 PM EDT 0 recs
Was that creaking the noise of Lesnar’s chair when he swiveled around?
by Baudelaire on
Sep 3, 2008 6:32 PM EDT
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HAHA! I think it was. I was waiting for him to pull a Tommy Boy and break the chair.
by dedstrk911 on
Sep 3, 2008 6:40 PM EDT
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He eats Bear Claws like most people eat freetos. The tiny BBQ flavored ones.
I told you I can't build your candy house! It will fall apart, the sun will melt the candy, it won't work!
by mma_dude on
Sep 3, 2008 6:58 PM EDT
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This is a powerful blow landed on Affliction -- ZUFFA will very shortly have the best fighter in every class LW and above!
After this fight Fedor is gonna be irrelevant. Everybody thought Fedor vs Couture was the heavyweight fight to determine the best heavyweight. After Lesnar dominates Couture, everybody will agree that the UFC has the best HW in the world.
I told you I can't build your candy house! It will fall apart, the sun will melt the candy, it won't work!
by mma_dude on Sep 3, 2008 6:39 PM EDT 0 recs
George, who is the best HW in the world?
I told you I can't build your candy house! It will fall apart, the sun will melt the candy, it won't work!
by mma_dude on
Sep 3, 2008 6:48 PM EDT
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If you have to ask then you shouldn’t be posting on a mixed martial arts blog.
by George Lucas on
Sep 3, 2008 7:13 PM EDT
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You sound like Clinton, “What the definition of is, is?” I’ll say it for you, FEDOR! What happens when Couture gets crushed by Lesnar? Maybe you think the fans want to see Silvia/Fedor 2.
I told you I can't build your candy house! It will fall apart, the sun will melt the candy, it won't work!
by mma_dude on
Sep 3, 2008 7:19 PM EDT
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… Fedor.
That was an easy question.
I still don’t quite get why being 1-1, having tapped out in less than 3 minutes, and then beating Herring — who most on here claimed was a pure can before that fight — suddenly vaults Lesnar to being the greatest thing ever to walk into an octagon.
Physically the guy is scary. Skill-wise he has shown next to nothing at all. In the Herring fight he destroyed Herring by managing to land a perfect first punch and then pouncing. I understand that you can’t discount just how powerful and perfect that punch was. But I can’t believe anyone watching that fight would disagree that if it had not landed perfectly — and in mma things don’t always go that perfectly — that entire fight would have been much, much different. Lesnar may still have won, easily even. But after that first huge punch he basically just got on top of Herring and managed to use his size and muscle to keep an already devastated Herring who has never been a particular great guy from the bottom neutralized. He couldn’t even finish him after that huge first shot. How that suddenly makes him the best in the world is just something I don’t quite understand.
Fedor may not have fought the best competition in the last couple of years, but despite that he finished Sylvia (who is arguably, if not definitely, considered to be a much better heavyweight than Herring) without even breaking a sweat. And that’s pretty much what he’s done to everybody he has fought, a list that includes significantly more top quality wins than a single decision victory over Heath Herring.
Lesnar may become the greatest heavyweight. His size and power may be too muich for anyone. He may dominate Randy (which may or may not prove anything, given the time off and the age and the legitimate questions about Randy’s heavyweight legacy). But as of right now, I just can’t believe you’re that impressed with his decision over Herring.
Just a difference of opinion.
by Kierkegaard on
Sep 3, 2008 7:17 PM EDT
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Unlike you, I don’ need to see a dozen fights before I can determine a guys potential. By the way, neither does Dana White, and neither does Randy Couture or any other HW in the UFC.
I told you I can't build your candy house! It will fall apart, the sun will melt the candy, it won't work!
by mma_dude on
Sep 3, 2008 7:22 PM EDT
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Yes clearly you don’t feel the need to watch fights.
by George Lucas on
Sep 3, 2008 7:31 PM EDT
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Yo baby, I agree with you.
This whole crazy situation isn’t gonna be resolved until we alter the crazy weight limits in the HW class. The way the class is set up now: a much larger, athletic, boxer/wrestler, can dominate. I agree with you that a 50 pound disparity in weight can make a huge difference in the fight — and it’s not fare! But, it is reality.
I told you I can't build your candy house! It will fall apart, the sun will melt the candy, it won't work!
by mma_dude on
Sep 3, 2008 7:43 PM EDT
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If Lesnar isn’t anything why would Fedor say he’d like to fight him? Why did Randy come back to fight him? I remember Randy saying only the Fedor fight intrests him. If the best want Lesnar it isn’t because he sucks. I don’t see either of them caring enough to want Kimbo. Anyone saying Fedor is irrelevant is smoking shit better then me though.
by Tommy7 on
Sep 3, 2008 7:58 PM EDT
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The problem is, you haven’t said that he has “the potential” to be the greatest heavyweight out there. You’ve said he already “is” the greatest heavyweight. And he hasn’t really done much of anything to justify that pedestal just yet. That’s all I’m saying.
by Kierkegaard on
Sep 3, 2008 11:27 PM EDT
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Right now the best is Fedor hands down. Then Big Nog and let the rest fight it out to see who’s where.
by Tommy7 on
Sep 3, 2008 11:33 PM EDT
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Dude...
anyone who considered Herring a can is out of their mind. He isn’t a worldbeater but the term “can” is taking it way too far. I mean…just insanely too far. Or else it’s just a basic lack of understanding of a term. A can isn’t a guy who will likely lose in a match-up. If that is the case than Fitch was a can in the GSP fight.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on
Sep 3, 2008 7:26 PM EDT
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You’re arguing semantics instead of refuting his points.
by George Lucas on
Sep 3, 2008 7:30 PM EDT
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No...
I’m not arguing with him at all. I agree that several people are probably jumping the gun. I have admitted that I am among the people giving Lesnar more love than he probably deserves at this point. This comes from just sheer interest in what I think he COULD be. He is such a freakish athlete…the ability to tryout for an NFL team and make a practice squad without having played any high level football is an amazing statement to his athletic abilities (and anyone who acts like he was somehow a failure because of what happened with not making the full squad is insane).
I’m just sick of the tendency of people to immediately write off an underdog in a fight as a “can.” It’s disrespectful to the fighters as well as just moronic revisionism. Especially considering that he said the following before the Lesnar/Herring fight:
Maybe it would go better for Herring because Herring is not already injured going into this fight? Or maybe because he has pretty much completely remade his body with new cardio and diet people in his corner since that fight? Or maybe because, for his faults, at least Jake O’Brien had almost a dozen fights under his belt and had enough legitimate experience to take advantage of Herring’s injury? Actually there are lots of reasons that the Jake O’Brien fight is probably not the one to base a prediction on …
Hmm…doesn’t sound like he thought he was a can until AFTER he lost. THAT, my friend, is not a can.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on
Sep 3, 2008 7:40 PM EDT
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Come on now, Brent. I know you can read better than a lot of the people around here who jump at the chance to twist somebody’s words into something they never said. Read my post again. I never called Herring a can. I expected him to win that fight. My point was that the bulk of the posts here and everywhere else before the fight and after the fight were generally of the tenor that Herring was not much of an opponent. I was basically arguing a losing battle in trying to make the case that Herring had a legitimate shot at winning against Lesnar, because most people seemed to expect Herring to get destroyed — and indicated in their posts that Herring was an easy opponent given to Lesnar to destroy to build his career. Despite the fact that most people (not me) were acting as if Herring was nothing, it seems odd to me that Lesnar’s sole UFC victory over Herring has suddenly propelled him to status as the greatest thing around. That’s all I was saying.
I don’t think Herring is a can now. I didn’t think he was then. I never said he is, was, or will be. I think the Lesnar/Herring fight was defined and determined largely by the fact that one perfect devastating punch landed. Lesnar gets credit for that — but one perfect punch doesn’t equate to “greatest heavyweight on the planet” in my book.
by Kierkegaard on
Sep 3, 2008 11:25 PM EDT
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0 recs
well then...
…shut up!
Seriously though. I’ll own up to the fact that I misread your post.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.