Frank Mir Talks Brock Lesnar
Sherdog has up some comments from Frank Mir on Brock Lesnar. Most revealing are his thoughts on what it was like to be in the cage (and underneath) Brock:
“He was more like getting hit by a car that’s moving very slowly and you can’t get out of the way,” says Mir. “It bumps and knocks you over and is just overwhelmingly powerful.”
Clinging to the underside of Lesnar’s hulking, 6-foot-3, 280-pound frame, Mir hadn’t realized he had gone for two armbars in the scuffle before transitioning to the fight-ending kneebar until he watched the tape later.
“I didn’t know where he was half the time,” he says. “It really felt like I was underwater and somebody was beating the s—-t out of me. I was just drowning under him.”
That fight was a battle of fight instincts where Mir was able to just use techniques pounded into him over years to eventually catch Lesnar in a mistake. But for a guy like Mir to say that he felt so helpless for most of the fight is very revealing. Size isn't the only factor in a fight but at 6'3" and over 240 lbs Mir is a large heavyweight and was left feeling like he was drowning. Randy Couture is not a large heavyweight and while his moxy and solid strategy usually allows him to overcome the size issue he has had problems with large heavyweights with strong top games in the past.
Also Mir explains why he isn't upset over Lesnar getting such a high profile title fight:
“I can get why Brock Lesnar’s getting the fight,” he says. “It’s not like I think it absurd. If Brock Lesnar was fighting some bum off the street, it would be a main event card. That’s Brock Lesnar. If ‘Kimbo Slice’ came into the UFC tomorrow, he’s probably going to be above me. That’s just the way it is. It’s name recognition.”
In Lesnar, who’s demonstrated a strong work ethic since joining the Minnesota Martial Arts Academy for his training, Mir sees a respected peer, albeit one who needs more time to develop his skills in the cage.
“A guy like Brock Lesnar doesn’t upset me at all, says Mir. ”I think he has the potential to be a very legitimate martial artist. … So when I stretched out his leg and felt him tapping, I didn’t even try to extend it even further. But somebody like a ‘Kimbo’ or somebody like that who I don’t think respects the sport, like a ‘Krazy Horse,’ I don’t think they have a place in it. The referee couldn’t get to me fast enough.”
UPDATE: Just a quick tip of the cap to Mythbuster who posted a fanpost on this that I somehow completely missed. Read it here.
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Some great quotes from Frank there. I’m stoked to see him fight Nog, but sometimes I wish he’d just give up fighting and go full-time into commentating and being a spokesman for the sport.
by Chris Nelson on Sep 24, 2008 11:01 AM EDT 0 recs
P.S. Randy is effed. :/ I don’t think there’s a gameplan around that could help him this time.
by Chris Nelson on
Sep 24, 2008 11:04 AM EDT
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I maintain that there is a path to victory for Randy
that involves leg kicks, submissions and cage-work. But it’s tricksy at best, since utilizing leg kicks and the cage inevitably present an opponent with a strong wrestling background to turn the tables on you in a heartbeat.
I don’t see Randy’s submissions being good enough to come in thinking he’ll weather the storm long enough to lock in a kimura or something. But you never know.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on
Sep 24, 2008 11:25 AM EDT
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As far as catching Lesnar in a kimura goes, I just cannot see it. His arms are too huge for Randy to be able to hold and torque badly enough to tap him out.
by dnevil001 on
Sep 24, 2008 12:07 PM EDT
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Good point.
I was just trying to example something other than a kneebar. I guess I could have gone with heel hook, or a triangle choke, but it seems to me that with the geometry of Lesnar’s head and neck, it’s going to be really hard to choke that man. Even using legs to apply the pressure. And there is simply no way Lesnar gets caught with a silly kneebar again. It’s possible if he tries to play jits on the ground that he could get rolled into one, but not a silly one-and-done kneebar like what Mir slapped on him.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on
Sep 24, 2008 12:14 PM EDT
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Lesnar is showing signs of ring intelligience as far as not just running in like James Thompson & just swinging for the fences. I think the major focus of his camp for this fight will be ensuring he does all the he can to keep himself out of any sub scenarios. With his strength I believe the only sub he still may be vulnerable to is the knee bar, which I am sure he works on daily so he does not get caught again.
As far as Mir goes, I admire his comments as it appears that he knew if that kneebar was not the end he was in for a long beatdown.
by dnevil001 on
Sep 24, 2008 12:36 PM EDT
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Agree
As much as I like Randy, Lesnar is not Sylvia and will not allow Randy to bully him around the ring & I seriously doubt that Randy will spend as much time on top of Lesnar like he did Sylvia. Can you imagine if he catches Captain America with that straight right like he did Herring? I am not sure the octagon will hold him in as he goes flying. If Randy does find some way to win this fight the only way imaginable that I see is snagging a sub.
by dnevil001 on
Sep 24, 2008 12:06 PM EDT
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Tiny correction: Mir’s 6’3".
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
by jemaleddin on Sep 24, 2008 11:36 AM EDT 0 recs
Yes....
…yes he is.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on
Sep 24, 2008 12:31 PM EDT
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Interesting insight overall, though I don’t get the Kimbo comment. From his training, to his interviews, to his fights, he seems to respect the sport.
by MonsterTruck on Sep 24, 2008 11:39 AM EDT 0 recs
I think the basis for most of the Kimbo hate stems from the fact that
he really isn’t recognized as an athlete first, and a fighter second. What this sport needs is legit athletes (like Lesnar, GSP, A. Silva and Rampage) to be the ambassadors. Having a street-fighter like Kimbo be one of the most recognizable people in the sport is bad for its image, overall, in the opinion of most people inside the MMA world.
I think Kimbo comes off quite well in interviews, and he’s obviously entertaining to watch fight (but then, so was Tank Abbot during his day), but he simply projects the wrong idea/notion/image.
We need more people like Couture in those positions. Heck, even Lesnar is a good ambassador for the sport, for all the hate he gets. And his pedigree lends legitimacy to the sport, being a world-class wrestler, having made an NFL training squad without experience or training, and being a big-time professional wrestler. A guy like that, who’s already made tens of millions of dollars and can choose what he wants to do with his prime athletic years, lends credence to the sport. A street-fighter from Miami invokes images of underground YouTube vids and cockfighting references, no matter how soft-spoken he is.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on
Sep 24, 2008 11:56 AM EDT
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But is it really Kimbo’s fault that he’s being promoted like this? He knows he wouldn’t last with a legit HW now and he’ll probably be the first to tell you that.
I understand hating the promotion behind him, but Kimbo himself?
by Tonley on
Sep 24, 2008 12:32 PM EDT
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He knows he wouldn’t last with a legit HW now and he’ll probably be the first to tell you that
… is that why he has called out people like Lidell? Because he “knows” he can’t hang with a legitimate fighter? (and yeah, I know Chuck is a LHW, but still).
I think the notion that you can’t hold Kimbo accountable for the cans he fights and the way he’s promoted wears thin. At some point he needs to actually step up and publicly demand to fight somebody of substance. He can’t have it both ways and enjoy the “benefits” of being promoted as much as he is without having to earn it in the ring.
Me personally, I hate the promotion not Kimbo himself. I’m not a fan of the guy, and I think the first time he fights somebody legitimate in a properly officiated fight he will lose — the most legitimate fighter he’s faced was Thompson, and without a bad stoppage he was losing that fight. I understand the business decision of Elite XC to shield him. But I’m tired of him being featured in their main events, promoted as a legitimate top fighter, etc., without having done a thing to earn any of it, and I’m tired of hearing that it’s not his fault and he should be blameless for all of it. That’s just my .02.
by Kierkegaard on
Sep 24, 2008 2:43 PM EDT
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… is that why he has called out people like Lidell? Because he "knows" he can’t hang with a legitimate fighter? (and yeah, I know Chuck is a LHW, but still).
Only because Chuck called him out in an interview about how he didn’t deserve the popularity he has. Right after he mentioned Chuck, he emphasized that he respects everyone in MMA and is still working himself up.
At some point he needs to actually step up and publicly demand to fight somebody of substance.
The guy has been only training for year. As much as his fights are overhyped, he’s fighting the level of opponents he should be fighting.
I’m tired of him being featured in their main events, promoted as a legitimate top fighter, etc., without having done a thing to earn any of it,
So am I but this is all ProElite’s doing.
by Tonley on
Sep 24, 2008 2:53 PM EDT
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Curious
I don’t mean this as sarcastic, but a real question – Who does EliteXC have that would be considered a legitimate opponent for Kimbo?
by mythbuster on
Sep 24, 2008 3:34 PM EDT
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Agreed
Do they have anyone that would be considered a true dual threat MMA guy in his weight class? I have no idea as I have not seen any of the guys for Elite
by dnevil001 on
Sep 24, 2008 3:42 PM EDT
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Kimbo said..
..to improve his cardio for his next fight, he gave up eating Snickers. And he meant it. Comments like that make him seem like he doesn’t work very hard. You could probably put him and Lesnar in the same bunch; guys that were popular coming in, but didn’t work for it as a mixed martial artist. The difference is you can see the videos of Brock dragging weights like a bull and juggling medicine balls, and you can see him in the octagon, having clearly developing his technical game. Whereas a guy like Kimbo is still going out there waving his arms around and gassing against Thompson, in the very same manner he did against Gannon. In actuality, he is still a street fighter. And that, to me, is what makes him a poor representation of the sport. Mir may have a similar outlook..
by Blackout612 on
Sep 24, 2008 1:29 PM EDT
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After writing this “you can see the videos of Brock dragging weights like a bull and juggling medicine balls, and you can see him in the octagon, having clearly developing his technical game”. how can you put Kimbo and Brock in the same bunch that did not work for it? True, he did not begin his career as a mixed martial artist, but how many guys have? A lot of guys were wrestlers just like he was and then found MMA as the true complete test as a fighter.
by dnevil001 on
Sep 24, 2008 1:33 PM EDT
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I think you’re saying the same thing he was saying. I think he meant that you could put them in the same bunch as guys that came in with a lot of hype and a big following without earning it in mma and working their way up, but the difference is that Brock has at least demonstrated a desire to earn it now that he is there. I think you’re both saying the same thing.
by Kierkegaard on
Sep 24, 2008 2:45 PM EDT
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I've got Brock in this one
Randy has not submitted anyone in the last decade, and Lesnar showed the discipline to not put himself in a dangerous position against Herring. Mir’s absolutely right – teach Brock a few submissions and that Herring fight ends in the first – and he’s a decent enough guy to acknowledge that Brock has a legitimate background to translate into MMA.
That being said , I still love ‘Crazy Horse’ Bennett. Double front kick with both arms on the ropes, baby.
by subo on Sep 24, 2008 12:38 PM EDT 0 recs
I love the Kimbo hate...can't get enough of it.
Let him grow and develop as a fighter. IMO there’s alot of MMA fighters who wish they did the same thing. Fight on youtube, gain fame. Obviously he trains or he wouldn’t be in such good shape. He’s just not in top fight shape, yet. He’s training with a top team so let’s just wait and see what happens.
As long as I see improvement fight to fight then I’m satisfied. He’ll never be a grappling technician because he’s not a grappler. That’s not his game. Just like I don’t expect a BJJ fighter to be a great stand-up fighter. That’s not what they do.
In term of Brock, he’s big, but still has a long way to go. He dominated Herring, but I didn’t see MMA domination. If Randy keeps this standing he wins. Unless Brock has improved his punching. Herring didn’t take him serious and paid the price. I can’t remember a time when Randy faced a person this big and strong (Sylvia doesn’t count). That’s what so scary about Brock. He’s big, strong, and quick for someone his size.
If Brock wins, he will most definitely become the champ after facing the winner between Mir/Nog. No way he gets caught in another submission so easily. But maybe I’m getting a little ahead of myself.
by Akorn on Sep 24, 2008 3:24 PM EDT 0 recs
Wait..
Can you tell me how Kimbo has improved? If anything, he made mistakes he’s never even made before in his last fight, not improved on anything he’s done in the past.
by Blackout612 on
Sep 24, 2008 3:56 PM EDT
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He lasted in the fight...
Kimbo’s first fights usually ended in the first round. Thompson was the first time he actually fought someone who knows ground fighting. I agree he tapped, but they didn’t stop it. If Kimbo comes out like last time Ken will beat him. Unless Ken tries to stand with him.
I know that’s not saying much, but I’m willing to wait a little while. After Ken, he has to fight better opponents. And he will.
by Akorn on Sep 24, 2008 11:55 PM EDT 0 recs
Kimbo Didn't Tap
I know, someone said it and so a lot of people want to believe it, but he didn’t tap. He really did give the ref the thumbs up.
[IMG]http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k72/mudpie_01/SliceThumbsUp.gif[/IMG]
by mythbuster on
Sep 25, 2008 8:49 AM EDT
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They might be talking about that time on the ground – it was questionable, if I recall… But I’m hazy – it’s hard to pay much attention to such a crappy amateurish fight.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
by jemaleddin on
Sep 25, 2008 11:14 AM EDT
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Maybe
I seem to recall this being the controversial one (which is why I had made an animated gif of it).
I don’t remember the other one, but could be so.
by mythbuster on
Sep 25, 2008 11:52 AM EDT
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