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Overhyped

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12941_mediumA lot of grumbling is going on in regards to Kimbo Slice's crappy cardio and his complete lack of a ground game. And that's fair: the man has work to do to live up to his hype. But who's to blame for that hype? i'd lay that at the feet of Gary Shaw and CBS. Slice is doing his best to sell himself, but he's never claimed to be anything other than what he is: a good street-fighter who is still learning MMA. Gary Shaw is the one saying that he'd beat Mike Tyson. 

But there's been a lot of hype for Kaitlin Young as well. The odd thing is that almost none of it came from EliteXC: Shaw was too busy hyping Slice and Gina Carano to worry about doing any more than claiming that Young was a game opponent for Carano. Bloggers for several sites got interviews with the 22-year-old college student and published breathless reports of her prowess in striking and on the ground. It was reported that she'd knocked 3 opponents out in one night, owing to her extensive Muay Thai training, and that she'd be better on the ground than Carano because she'd participated in some grappling tournaments. 

The fact that the three girls she knocked out that night were all participating in their first event? Or that her 4 KOs were against women who now have a combined record of 4-5? Not important, even though Carano has beaten well-known fighters like Tonya Evinger and Julile Kedzie. What about the fact that her first MMA event was a short 7 months ago? Not an issue, even though Carano has been fighting and training MMA with one of the best camps in the world for 2 years. And what about that Muay Thai training? Young is 3-2 in amateur competition, while Carano was 12-1-1 as a professional and the first American woman to win a Muay Thai championship in Thailand. 

Much was made of a video, circulated by Young's camp, of her flipping tires and puling a truck across a parking lot, even though she is clearly the smaller and weaker of the two. Not to mention that the last mixed martial artist to be featured doing so-called "caveman" training was Young's teammate at the Minnesota Martial Arts Academy Sean Sherk, who was subsequently stripped of his title for testing positive for steroids. 

In hindsight, it's no surprise that Carano dominated the fight from beginning to end. While her shooting schedule for American Gladiators clearly shortened her training camp and left her overweight and out of breath during the fight, she had more than enough strength and skill to take out Young. When fighting on the ground, Young attempted one strike and no submission attempts.  Working from her back, Carano on the other hand, quickly brought her leg up to attempt a gogoplata submission - a relatively advanced technique. By the fight's end, the only damage done to Carano was a little smeared mascara, while Young looked as though she'd been hit by a truck. But this wasn't exactly a surprise: Carano was up against a smaller opponent with less experience who was facing top competition for the first time in her first televised fight. Who can win in that situation?

The blogosphere likes to view itself as free of many of the sins of the mainstream media. But bloggers are just as likely to fall for a convincing story-line in the face of overwhelming evidence as anyone. When a likable fighter talks herself up, we listen without questioning what she says. We like to be skeptical of what we hear from the news outlets, but we must apply that skepticism to our own work as well.

The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Bloody Elbow readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bloody Elbow editors or staff.

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I agree. Seems Young got thrown to the wolves on this, and did the best she could to make it a fight.

I also found Caranos comment to be pretty disrespectful, after winning the fight and talking about how little training she actually did for it. But that could just be me.

by mythbuster on Jun 1, 2008 8:47 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

A bit disrespectful, but -

I sorta felt like Gus put her in a bad spot – he led her down a bad route with, “was this your toughest fight?” What was she supposed to say? It clearly wasn’t that tough of a fight for her, and if she’d had time to prepare, she would have ended it much sooner and without giving up an eighth of her purse. She decided to change the subject.

Besides, I have a hard time with the concept of interviewing athletes right after they get done competing, especially fighters. Has anyone ever given a really good post-fight interview? I’d suggest that you can’t hold somebody to the things they say after getting punched in the face. :-)

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.

by jemaleddin on Jun 1, 2008 8:55 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

nice post, jem

by robnashville on Jun 1, 2008 8:57 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

... of course not everyone was on the Kaitlyn Young bandwagon before this fight.

I couldn’t agree more about the question of Carano after the fight about whether this was her toughest fight. It clearly wasn’t. She came in without properly training, was out of breath, and still destroyed Young and the fight didn’t reach the third round. I thought she was respectful in handling a stupid question right on the spot like that.

I think Young has a future and she clearly has some impressive standup. She just wasn’t ready for somebody with as much experience and technical ability as Carano.

by Kierkegaard on Jun 1, 2008 10:25 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

It'd be nice...

...to let Kaitlin spend a few more years training MMA and see where she’s at. The kid is obviously a phenomenal athlete and just needs more technique. I think she could beat a lot of women at 135 – but not Carano at 145. :-)

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.

by jemaleddin on Jun 1, 2008 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think people jumped on the Young bandwagon because the perceived lack of focus Carano has recently given her MMA career. However, Young deserved whatever attention she got before the fight given the massive amount of hype surrounding her opponent. She certainly deserved the percentage of Carano’s purse she received for the weight discrepancy.

I was a little guilty of thinking Young was more ready than she actually was. I don’t like how Gary Shaw does business, but he was able to find a “game” opponent that wasn’t a huge threat to one of his main assets. The weight thing is still going to cast a shadow on the Carano victory for hardcore fans though.

by Cannon Jacques on Jun 1, 2008 10:36 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Last Night

Last Night proved that Gary Shaw isn’t looking to give his stars any real competition. When Smith and Thompson started winning, two washed-up fighters to be honest, they had controversial fight stoppages. With that in mind, there’s no what that Carano’s going to face somebody at her own level under Shaw.

Which is sad, because she’s a hell of a fighter.

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.

by jemaleddin on Jun 1, 2008 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I was wrong

And inflated Young’s ability, but it wasn’t as if there were zero reasons to think Carano’s lack of preparedness could have cost her even against a neophyte. But yes, I let my distaste for Gina’s preferential treatment go too far. Nothing to do but go back to the drawing board.

by Luke Thomas on Jun 1, 2008 11:10 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

(Oh crap)

(I made the front page? I didn’t realize this was the kind of post that you did that to somehow. Thanks, KN! Oh, and Luke, this wasn’t directed at you, just so you know.)

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.

by jemaleddin on Jun 1, 2008 12:52 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Look at you, ya celebrity! Good post.

(the poster formerly known as holden636)

by TheFightJournal on Jun 1, 2008 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wish I would have known it was going to happen – I would have put on something nice! (Or at least tried to come off less confrontational.)

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.

by jemaleddin on Jun 1, 2008 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hype, or something else?

I don’t think this really qualifies as hype. Luke and Bloody Elbow just brought a human element to person that Elite XC hired to be the next faceless victim in Gina’s ascension in the MMA world. In other words, they interviewed somebody that we would have no otherwise known anything about and, if nothing else, made this fight more interesting. I’ve casually rooted for Gina in her last several fights, but after reading about the blue-collar Young, I had to root for the underdog. This feeling was further compounded by Gina’s weigh-in debacle.

Hence, BE and any blog who had the nerve to build up an unknown fighter were really just making the fight more interesting for us to watch. Hype is a different animal.

by Popetastic on Jun 1, 2008 1:09 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Hey

I wasn’t intending for this to be a slam at BE – I think my respect for the writers and love for the community here is pretty well documented (in my family we show love by holding people’s feet to the fire). BE wasn’t the only place that interviewed her – and absolutely wasn’t the strongest Young supporting web site I read. One of the great things about this site is that there isn’t a single editorial voice: every one of the writers has a different perspective, so you get pretty balanced coverage – even if it means I end up disagreeing with everybody once in a while. :-)

And even better than the wide range of opinions on the staff is the fact that they’re willing to stick a fan on the front page voicing a contrarian opinion. Especially if that fan is a pot-stirrer like me.

I too really hoped that Young could do something great last night – and she did put on a hell of a show given her limited experience. I’m counting myself as a Kaitlin Young fan from here on out – she stepped up to her hardest challenge and she never backed down. Even when she was getting beaten pretty badly in the stand-up, she was still walking Carano down and trying her best to win. That’s extraordinary in my book.

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.

by jemaleddin on Jun 1, 2008 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, she definitely fought with heart. And Gina demonstrated how skilled she is, probably better than most other times I’ve seen her fight. Young is only 22, so the sky’s the limit. Taking on the face of women’s MMA is no easy task.

by Popetastic on Jun 1, 2008 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You know, I think we all forgot how good Gina is. Her striking is simply excellent, and those front kicks completely took Young out of her game.

by Michael Rome on Jun 1, 2008 1:54 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I certainly did. I forgot just how good her Muay Thai really is. Though I do agree with Luke; I wish Gina would actually put forth the requisite effort to make weight (though I could be wrong on my reading of her comments in the post-fight interview, but it didn’t sound like making weight was a big priority for her). However, Shaw should certainly shoulder some of the blame for continuing to have her fight 135 pound fighters at 140 (though if Gina doesn’t make the weight, the fight will still happen), rather than have her fight 145 pound fighters at 145 (yes, there are a lot fewer women there but that doesn’t make all of this acceptable by default).

by Estrada on Jun 1, 2008 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Elsewhere

I addressed Gina’s weight issues in another FanPost: Carano’s Bargain. Call me biased, but I think I have a good answer to why she did what she did.

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.

by jemaleddin on Jun 1, 2008 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good post.

by Yasnian on Jun 1, 2008 5:45 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

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