EliteXC 'PrimeTime': Weigh-in Results; Carano Fails to Make Weight
by Nick Thomas on May 30, 2008 2:42 PM EDT
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PrintMain Card:
Kevin "Kimbo Slice" Ferguson (235.5) vs. James Thompson (257)
EliteXC champ Robbie Lawler (184.5) vs. Scott Smith (184.5)
Gina Carano (144.5) vs. Kaitlin Young (140.5)
Jon Murphy (260.5) vs. Brett Rogers (263.5)
Phil Baroni (185) vs. Joey Villasenor (184.5)
Look's like Gina Carano couldn't make 140. Pictures coming soon.
[UPDATE]
* - New Jersey Deputy Attorney General Nick Lembo said the Gina Carano-Kaitlin Young bout was scheduled to be contested at 140 pounds. Both fighters were aware that Carano would be over weight before the weigh-ins, and a percentage of Carano's purse was awarded to Young. Lembo was unsure of the amount but believed it to be 12 to 12.5 percent.
HT: mmajunkie.com
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I’m a little torn on Gina and her weight.
Are there not any girls weighing over 140 pounds for her to fight? If not, EXC should come to the clubs with me on the weekends, I have no problem finding the big girls, lol.
On the other hand, missing weight by only 3.5 pounds, makes me think that she just needs help in the cutting department, though I imagine cutting is harder for females.
"They said you was hung!!"
"And they was RIGHT!"
So unprofessional
Amir Ranavardi once told me something that stuck with me. He was in the middle of a very difficult cut to 170lbs and I asked him if he ever thought about winging it and seeing if they just thought they could create a catch weight for him. He said, “As a fighter I have two responsibilities: make weight and fight.” He saw making weight as part of the fight process and I think that’s correct.
This is a weight class created specially for Carano and she can’t even make weight. I realize the pressure on her to fight and do American Gladiators causes her ability to keep her weight down difficult, but tough shit. It’s her job to do and it’s completely unprofessional to not make the weight…again.
He saw making weight as part of the fight process and I think that’s correct.
I’d have to agree. I remember past TUF shows where people didn’t make weight, and it was considered pretty noobish. Cutting weight seems to be one of the first things fighters have to get used to.
I like Gina but seriously, it’s getting harder and harder to take her seriously…
What does this mean, is the fight off or did Kaitlin give the ok?
I’m curious if they’ll broadcast that she didn’t make weight.
I wonder if she even tried to make weight or figured she’d be over and just not tried at all.
If she actually tried to make weight and cut big-time then she’ll likely outweigh Young significantly for the fight.
Disappointing she didn’t make weight. I know I was corrected earlier that she failed to make weight only once before but I knew she’d fail to make weight this time too.
That's what I kept assuming...
...once word came out that she was going to have trouble with the cut AGAIN I just started thinking “she doesn’t actually CARE because they’ll let the fight go on anyway.”
I’m starting to regret the bet I placed on Kaitlin now that she’s going to be at least 5 lbs smaller at fight time (probably closer to 10). I knew she’d be smaller at fight time…but when the other fighter doesn’t have to make the full cut they don’t go through that draining process which carries over to the fight.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn't worry
I bet Young is in 10x better shape anyway. Gina probably punted on the cut because of how much it would take out of her for a fight she didn’t have much time to prepare for. Gina might be a little bigger, but zero chance she has as much in the gas tank.
God, how incredibly unprofessional.
* – New Jersey Deputy Attorney General Nick Lembo told MMAjunkie.com the Gina Carano-Kaitlin Young bout was scheduled to be contested at 140 pounds. Both fighters were aware that Carano would be over weight before the weigh-ins, and a percentage of Carano’s purse was awarded to Young. Lembo was unsure of the amount but believed it to be 12 to 12.5 percent.
sounds fair…
Lame
Carano’s been talking about how making weight won’t be a problem for weeks. Then she comes in 4.5 pounds over? Further, she knows she’s under more scrutiny because she’s the “face of women’s MMA” and the fact that she never turns down an interview. For her to do this shows very little respect for the sport she claims to love. Incredibly unprofessional and I hope she gets knocked the fuck out.
And yes, I know her boobs are bigger. I know they weigh more than her opponents. I know they offer her no competitive advantage. I also know as well as she does, that they’re on the scale with her so she needs to account for them. No more excuses.
OK
Her boobs don’t actually weigh more than her opponents (presumably), but her boobs weigh more than her opponent’s boobs.
by jebushchrist on May 30, 2008 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
No, she didn't
But I’ve been hearing Carano lovers using that as an excuse.
by jebushchrist on May 30, 2008 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Ditto...
I’ve heard that twice since the announcement already.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Talking to my wife...
...whom I must say is an expert on boobs….because she does have them…
She wanted me to remind everyone that there is a direct correlation between your overall weight and the size of your boobs. Generally speaking if you lose weight…your breasts don’t stay the same size…
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Which is because a decent portion of the breast is composed of adipose tissue (fat cells). Though there is a good bit of individual variation, most women will tell you that when they start losing weight that one of the first places they visually notice the weight loss is in their breasts.
No offense to Brent or Estrada but I really hope a conversation with a wife/woman wasn’t necessary to learn that information.
I assume anyone who has been though junior high is aware of the correlation between breasts and fat.
Haha...
no…it wasn’t necessary. She is an MMA fan and was sitting next to me when we were reading the comments and she said “tell those idiots __” with the idiots being people who were blaming her breasts for her weight.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 7:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Hmmm...
I don’t think the conversation was “necessary”, per se, but one can’t turn down an opportunity to have a relevant conversation about boobs.
by jebushchrist on May 30, 2008 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions
True, but varies by individual physiology… no spot reduction, right? On the average I’ll bet you’re right though.
by swarmofkillermonkeys on May 31, 2008 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Hey!
So we now have this:
Incredibly unprofessional and I hope she gets knocked the fuck out.
But two days ago you were saying this:
“Until she fails to make weight for a fight, I can’t believe anyone is talking about it.”—jebushcrist 5/28/2008
Uh, wanna retract that now? :-)
I’m just saying: we had a reason to worry about her making weight – and so did she.
(Just screwing with you – all in fun, dude!)
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
No need to retract
You weren’t “worried about her making weight”, you were killing her for being “pretty close” to missing weight, which is an inane criticism. I was merely pointing out the fact at the time: She’d never failed to make weight. Now that she has, criticism of her is fair.
I’ll spare everyone the pallid bible quote you laid on me.
So, why aren’t you killing Kaitlin Young now? She was “pretty close” to missing weight.
by jebushchrist on May 30, 2008 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions
No, she didn't
1 pound grace for non-title fight, and .5 pound for clothing allowance. That’s 141.5 which is what she weighed.
by jebushchrist on May 30, 2008 8:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Half Pound Clothing Allowance
Is this real? Can you provide a link to the rules or something? I’ve just never heard of this before.
I'm personally not sure...
...if the .5 clothing allowance is real, exists only for females, or is just kind of a “if you’re within .5 we know you can strip and make it” deal.
I’ve heard it talked about a lot though.
Regardless, .5 lbs is easily sweat out in the 1 hour if it were considered over weight. The 140 lb fights are considered at that weight for EXC that I know…it isn’t considered a catch weight. It’s basically “ginaweight” which she now can’t be bothered to make. So up to 141 should be considered legal. If the .5 clothing allowance exists then you have to 141.5.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 9:30 PM EDT up reply actions
For the record, I went back and watched the youtube video of the ElitleXC: Uprising Weigh-ins and Everything stopped when Carano weighed in. She couldn’t even stand still on the scale. When they got a number it was 141.1. The announcer wasn’t sure of anything. The announcer waited for someone else to declare it was ok. He said that she was .1 over (confirming the one pound allowance) and he pointed out that she had shorts on in a way that doesn’t confirm the .5 for clothing. Gina didn’t wait for anything. She got off the scale as fast as she could and downed some pedialite. Tonya seemed angry and protested thinking Gina was 1.1 over until it was explained to her that you get a pound for non-title fights.
Heheh
Remind me never to get on a boat when you’re the captain: “We don’t have to worry about icebergs until we hit them. We don’t have to worry about leaks until the boat sinks. And we don’t have to worry about getting into the life rafts until somebody drowns.”
It’s okay to worry about stuff when IT’S OBVIOUS THAT IT’S HAPPENING.
Your point didn’t seem to be just that she hadn’t failed to make weight: it was that we shouldn’t predict that she’d fail to make weight or be concerned about the possibility. So yeah, pretty wrong.
The Bible quote (check my blog, I’m a devoted atheist) was the origin of that old saying, “there are none so blind as those that will not see.” (Dad’s a minister, so I was forced to learn a lot of this stuff.) And you just seemed intent on not seeing what was going on with Carano’s weight. Besides, who has christ in his username? :-)
As for Kaitlin, I’ve been bad-mouthing her as an over-hyped kid with almost no experience who is too small and too green to be fighting Gina all along. Check my comments. As for her weight, she did make under 141, right? But I don’t have to worry about her making weight anymore because we’ll never see her again.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
The thing I hate about this is that Gina’s opponents pretty much have no choice but to accept the catchweight because fighting her would give them more visibility and popularity (which leads to bigger pay days) than any other fight out there.
You know, I would have zero problem with a sanctioning body doing this:
title fight-must make weight
non title fight-1 pound grace
non title fight- 3 pounds grace with opponents acceptance and percentage of purse forfeited
non title fight-over 3 pounds fighter is disqualified and fined
"They said you was hung!!"
"And they was RIGHT!"
this is why it really sucks, making weight is one thing but on a show like this (or womens MMA for that matter) the opponent pretty much HAS to take the fight to get some exposure. (thus putting themselves at a serious disadvantage in some cases)
I hope there is video of these weigh-ins. I want to see if that slimy Shaw leans on Young to “just take the fight” like the last time Carano didn’t make weight.
It’s too bad. For some reason she just hasn’t been able to make weight cutting an exact science…or so it seems. Part of the fight game is weight cutting and you’ve gotta do it successfully to be taken serious. Not sure how many more times this can happen.
She’ll have some ‘ring rust’ but overall I think she takes a decision here.
For crying out loud
She trains at Xtreme Couture. If she can’t learn how to cut weight there, then she can’t learn how to cut weight period.
This may sound odd...
...but I have a feeling that EXC probably won’t mention the weight thing on air. Just for the reason that networks are very careful about the “female body image” thing. This isn’t me being sexist at all. But I honestly think that there is a part of the population that would be upset if Gina weren’t treated as “fine just how she is.”
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 3:53 PM EDT reply actions
also
I think it’ll be telling if they don’t mention it. Carano is their golden child and they don’t want her image “tarnished”. If they cover this up, it’ll let me know exactly what kind of organization they are.
Can you imagine the UFC hiding the fact that Lutter didn’t make weight for a freaking title shot (that they handed him on a reality show)?
by jebushchrist on May 30, 2008 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Boxing...and the UFC
Both have started treating not making weight as a disgrace. When Corrales/Castillo III was canceled because Castillo failed to make weight (he failed the second time also but Corrales agreed to fight anyway…something he did not want to do in the rubber match) he was blasted both on-air and in the media.
If EXC mentions it but just treats it as an “oh well…it happens” situation. You’re right. That would be very telling.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Also, what’s up with the commission not giving her time to try and cut down more? At least Lutter spent an hour in the sauna to try and shake the weight off.
It sounds like...
...they knew that she wasn’t making weight and already agreed to have part of her purse given to Kaitlin. So again…it just seems like she doesn’t care if she makes the cut or not.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions
This is a disgrace. To have any sort of credibility they’ll need to make that point on the air during her fight.
by Richard Wade on May 30, 2008 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions
This is a different issue though, since it’s about MAKING weight for a certain weight class. Other fighters aren’t given the same leeway she’s received so far.
Can someone enlighten me a bit? I don’t understand what’s so difficult about cutting to 140 if she’s had more than enough time to prepare for it. She’s at a great camp with every fitness whatever guru she needs to plan out the cut. How come she rarely ever makes weight? Is it just impossible for her body type?
I like her and what she’s doing for the sport and all that, but things like this just ain’t helping the situation any.
Cutting...
Cutting is almost entirely mental. Sure…every fighter has a threshold that they can’t cut below. But Gina CAN make the cut to 140. The problem is that she doesn’t seem to care if she does it or not. 144.5 doesn’t seem like an “attempted cut” at all to me.
Some people just can’t bring themselves to go through the hell that is cutting weight. Trust me…it sucks. It is hard work and very physically, emotionally and mentally draining. But it isn’t impossible by any stretch of the imagination. I am just getting the feeling that she knows she’ll be able to fight anyway.
One thing that I wonder is if, being the golden child, that she’ll be given a “bonus” to make up for the fact that she is giving up 12% of her purse. Wouldn’t want the golden child to be unhappy.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Cutting is one thing
A question I have is whether there are enough women to make active competition in the world of MMA. Frankly, I for one am tired of hearing about Carano and the duality of being a superstar and an MMA fighter. If an athlete can’t perform to a level of extraordinary competition, what the hell is the point of even watching? Slowly, I am starting to think she is a pull for Elite-XC to capture the male audience with the mentality that men want to watch “hot” women beat each other up. And perhaps it isn’t Kimbo who is a “bad” image for the sport (he really isn’t as he trains hard with Bas) but Gina who seems to be riding this wave of unnecessary and even inappropriate popularity.
"Common sense is in spite of, not as the result of education. "
-Victor Hugo
Actually...
There have been many instances of this in combat sports, Diego Corralles vs damn, can’t remember his name now, lol, but they did the same thing.
The big difference here, is the only ones sweating Gina about is a few posters and bloggers. Meanwhile, Lutter, Reudigger and all the guys who miss weight, seemingly get chastised for it.
I know rules are different for hot chicks, lol, but this is ridiculous.
"They said you was hung!!"
"And they was RIGHT!"
Corrales vs. Castillo
Castillo didn’t make weight in the rematch (the first fight remains one of the greatest fights of all time) and Corrales agreed to the fight with the purse penalties. Then in the third fight he failed to make weight again so the fight was called off.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Hell, didn’t Lutter say he received death threats after that?
by Richard Wade on May 31, 2008 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Umm
Anybody else think Phil Baroni is going to get knocked out?
"Common sense is in spite of, not as the result of education. "
-Victor Hugo
My gambling bankroll...
....sure seems to think so ;)
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I mean to respond to your comment.
"Common sense is in spite of, not as the result of education. "
-Victor Hugo
Haha.
Joey Villasenor is no joke and at one point before there were “official rankings” I thought he could have been a top 10 MW. The inner WWE fan inside of me is a fan of Baroni but I’ve often questioned his work ethic, I find myself asking this question, “Dude, Baroni. Are you going to learn any techniques with those muscles?”
"Common sense is in spite of, not as the result of education. "
-Victor Hugo
True.
The thing that I can never figure out with Phil. Is that everyone on earth knows that cardio is a major issue for him. The problem is…he doesn’t seem to care.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Since Elite-XC is still in its prenatal state, I see Baroni fading off into obscurity unless Elite-XC goes the way of pro-wrestling entertainment. And you’re right to say he doesn’t care, he has the most excellent opportunity to showcase himself this Sunday night and he works with excellent camps, doing the minimum of amount of work loses fans.
"Common sense is in spite of, not as the result of education. "
-Victor Hugo
Unless they go the way of pro-wrestling entertainment? Haven’t they already done that?
by Richard Wade on May 30, 2008 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
They have some excellent fighters in their roster, but they will soon need to make up their minds on choosing an identity.
"Common sense is in spite of, not as the result of education. "
-Victor Hugo
True, but they’re promoting the freaks, not the excellent fighters.
by Richard Wade on May 31, 2008 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Catch Weight 140
I thought since it was a catch weight match at 140 that there was no 1 pound allowance. I understand the Young would make the weight if she had to strip down, but techniqually she didn’t make weight either. I am really just trying to point out that its catch weight.
The other thing I wanted to get to is that I think Young will be the bigger fighter in this match. I think if Carano said she wasn’t going to make the weight and didn’t even attempt the 145 is about her natural weight. Young said she cuts about 10 to get to 135 and wanted to put more muscle on to cut down from even higher.
There is a .5
lb allowance for clothing I thought. Also…she could easily sweat off .5 in an hour to make weight. So no…I wouldn’t say that she didn’t make weight.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
"The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls and looking like hard work." -- Thomas Edison
by Brent Brookhouse on May 30, 2008 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Here’s an interview with Kaitlin where she lays out just what everybody was supposed to weigh and just what they did weigh.
http://mmarated.com/users/video/163/516.html;jsessionid=22AB115FD430A254C67F8A2E32BB0F8D
Why does Gary Shaw get a free pass?
Most posters here have been attacking Carano but the blame needs to go both ways. It’s certainly unprofessional that she doesn’t make 140 but it’s just as unprofessional of Gary Shaw to continue giving her fights at 140 when he knows she won’t make the weight.
If Gina’s employer doesn’t care why should she put herself through the heavy strain of cutting weight? The criticism should be equally directed at Shaw for continually allowing this to happen. You can picture the outrage directed at Dana White if he decided that Liddell could weigh 210 while requiring his opponents to weigh in at 205.
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