Iron Ring May Suck, But So Do You

by Kid Nate on Apr 24, 2008 3:13 PM EDT in News Comment 17 comments

I'm not getting as much irate response to my "I like Iron Ring" post yesterday as I was hoping for, but one "writer" did take the bait. His beef basically came down to my use of the term "fanboy whining."

Look, watch the show if you want, it's your prerogative. But don't call me names because I feel it insults my sport and my intelligence."

As a whining fanboy myself, I don't really take umbrage at the term but I guess some others are more sensitive. Sorry dude, but had I known you existed I would have said, "Josh's post repeats the same old whining fanboy complaint that everyone but that one guy who writes for 5oz but isn't Sam or Adam is repeating. That Michael dude is stone standing up for the honor of MMA with a thoughtful, well articulated position that certainly doesn't smack of racism." How's that?

Again, I understand why many don't care for Iron Ring but I don't think the objections amount to much more than "I don't like these people and I don't like what they're doing to MY sport."

Shit, its not even like they're putting on Rio Heroes here -- a piece of shit that many fanboy bloggers had no problem taking advertising money from. The BET matches take place in rings, with gloves, refs and ringside doctors. That's a far cry from Felony Fights.

The fact is, Iron Ring reminds me of the early UFCs -- except with better athletes, higher production values, and more concern for fighter safety. And that's a proven way to introduce MMA to a brand new audience, which is what BET is doing.

Another thing from Iron Ring that reminds me of the old UFC days is this highly amusing debate on the BET forums involving a couple of the traditional martial arts guys who were involved with the show. One of them even dredges up the old "UFC won't let REAL kung fu masters be on the show because they fear our deadly chi powers" argument:

So that you know, I'm the manager of Novell Bell, Dipset's couch.. The main reason we even got involved in this was because the mma guys think that they are the end all be all of combat. We beg to differ. First of all you didn't see any Kung Fu on the Iron Ring because that footage wasn't put in.

Prior to 1930, all MA contest In China had no rules. After that point it was no eyes, no groin, or spine. Full technique was employed. My question to you is do you think that BJJ could handle the full technique of any style from a properly trained practitioner without all the limitations? I feel it would change things considerably, for example: An Eagle claw stylist of Kung Fu speciality is locks with a training goal of the grip alone being able to pulverize bone.A snake stylist who uses his fingers to strike with the power to penetrate an inch from the surface of the body. There are a lot of skills out here that still exist, but understandably these abilities are not allowed into the sports arena. The whole MMA mentality has really gotten a little out of hand. It's a sport, not true Martial arts. Martial means war.

In the interest of fairness, one of the coaches has a more informed view:

The individuals I pick for team dipset all had Mixed Martial art back ground: LW - Josh Key; MW - Daniel Akinyemi; HW - Carlos Moreno; HW Jared Palmer MW Jose Rodriguez; MW Mike Mullero; LW Ameer Richard; LW Mike Easton

None of these brothers to my knowledge practice any system of Chinese martial arts. They are MMA fighters and did well in the tryouts is why I picked them to fight for team dipset.

When I pick fighters , my pick is base on a fighters power, speed, technique, and adaptability to changing situations. I talk about all this in my profile interview, but for some reason BET did not air my true viewpoints about martial arts.

The bottom line no matter what style of martial arts a individual practice , be it karate, judo, mix martial arts , kung fu, in order to be a good fighter in combat, a individual will need to have many kinds of skills. A brother will need to have the right mindset when facing an opponent , they technique must be alive, fast and powerful, and a brother would need to know how and when to capitalize on opportunities and apply thier techniques in an ingenious way feel me. So truth of the matter is I looked for fighters for team dipset that techniques were skillful , but they also could adapt their strategy wisely in combat, standing or ground fighting.

But as one of my good friends told me about reality shows; they "create" characters in the editing room. They could try to make the brother with the sword talk either look like the bomb, or like all he spits is theory- it's all up to the "editing gods . When it came down to me, they edit me into looking like a street fighter with no understanding of martial arts at all. O well All I can say is I learned from this experience so if next time I ever do a martial art reality show like this again I'll be more on point.

Outside of the SPIKE tv demographic, UFC just isn't that well known. And as Luke can attest, the live crowds at recent UFC's aren't the most evolved or enlightened folks. The reality is that MMA is largely popular with wrestling fans who have grown up a bit and want more reality in their action. Don't believe me? Ask Dana White:

MMAPayout.com has learned that the UFC is talking to FOX's entertainment division as opposed to its sports division. This was the company's same tack in negotiations with CBS and NBC. In theory, the promotion would enjoy greater editorial control as an entertainment property, which was reportedly a sticking point in its negotiations with HBO and CBS.

Dana is a realist and he recognizes that the sport's success so far has come from marketing it outside the traditional sports marketing channels. He's explicitly followed the WWE path and it has worked brilliantly so far. I don't expect the Iron Ring guys to be a big competitor to the UFC anytime soon, but I do admire their savvy in finding an alternate marketing path -- one that's virgin territory for MMA. And that's the thing about virgin territory, penetrating it always involves a little pain and confusion. But the guys behind Iron Ring were with the UFC in its very early days and have not lost site of something that's absolutely essential to MMA's success -- it's fighting. We're selling and buying violence kiddies, you can put the candy coating on it all you want, but it is what it is. Iron Ring takes the necessary precautions for fighter safety and that's really all that's required. The rest is just what kind of candy coating you want it wrapped in, and their brand doesn't suck the same way the IFL and other fiascos have.

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Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

I don't expect the Iron Ring guys to be a big competitor to the UFC anytime soon, but I do admire their savvy in finding an alternate marketing path -- one that's virgin territory for MMA. And that's the thing about virgin territory, penetrating it always involves a little pain and confusion

lol.

As for your article, I agree completely... The cultural differences are the main points of contention to the show, where as that should be what people embrace. The sport is supposed to cross these boundaries, because it is about finding continuous ways to grow the sport, and celebrities as popular as T.I., and Mayweather being a part of it are going to bring in a lot more casual fans. I think diehards, and mma fans online forget that not everyone is going to enjoy the sport for the same reasons they do, nor do they recognize that the current MMA fan is not an elitist who has been following the sport since it's beginning, but rather a young guy, who enjoys watching the fights, drinking with his buddies. For MMA to grow, we're going to need more than the frat boy demographic, plain and simple.

by LootMMA on Apr 24, 2008 4:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

Interestingly enough, I find it odd how many sites are displacing the view that guys like Kimbo Slice and the personalities on Iron Ring are not going to draw in casual fans.

I have the opposite viewpoint, and I think some writers and fans alike are dellisional in not seeing that the casual fanbase LOVES brawls and knockouts. The technique is an acquired taste to many people. It takes time to appreciate that aspect of the fight game, but to a casual fanbase, I firmly believe Kimbo could blow up due to his thuggish looks and raw power. Frat boys in their 20's will eat that shit up, and i think Iron Ring works off that as well.

by Leland Roling on Apr 24, 2008 4:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

The friends I have who aren't into MMA that much (which is almost all of them) don't know a UFC fighter outside of Lesnar (mainly because of his WWE background), Chuck and Rampage (because of the 2nd time he beat Chuck) but they all know the street legend Kimbo Slice.

On the ESPN message board discussions after Kimbo beat Tank, there were tons of people saying how Kimbo would eventually rule the UFC heavyweight class and would probably take out Tim Sylvia. As crazy as that sounds, Kimbo's image and performances so far (including his Youtube street fights) has basically turned Kimbo into Mike Tyson 2.0 in the eyes of those who don't really pay attention to the sport.

by Tonley on Apr 24, 2008 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

You are exactly right. There is a disconnect between the type of fans that are on here/other blogs/forums and the casual fans. As much as I wish I was wrong, I think that the majority of MMA fans want to see the knock-down, drag-out brawls. Most of us, on the other hand, prefer more technique and skill (and a good slug-fest once in a while). It almost seems like wine drinkers vs. beer drinkers.

(the poster formerly known as holden636)

by TheFightJournal on Apr 25, 2008 1:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

I wish that guy quoted above would watch the "Kiai master vs. MMA" video that's made the rounds. That's some real power right there. As long as you can convince a large group of people to play along.

-- Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ

by jemaleddin on Apr 24, 2008 5:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

Here's the video -- you might want to shield your eyes while the chi blasts are flying.

by Kid Nate on Apr 24, 2008 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

I haven't read Michael's take on this subject, but I'm curious. What did he say that was racist?

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Apr 24, 2008 9:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

Lol. He didn't say anything racist I was just taking a cheap shot to be funny.

by Kid Nate on Apr 24, 2008 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

But I also have to say that much of the negativity towards Iron Ring in the mma/blog/forum community comes from discomfort with hip hop culture.

by Kid Nate on Apr 24, 2008 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

Discomfort with hip hop culture isn't racism either just for the record.

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Apr 25, 2008 2:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

This is true. Much discomfort with/resistance to hip hop culture comes from older black folks.
But its just a product of my experience -- when I see mobs of irate white frat boys virulently dissing black rappers, I brace myself for the inevitable slurs to start flying.

by Kid Nate on Apr 25, 2008 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

I'd like a weasel word in that sentence: something like "necessarily" or "always." Because a lot of discomfort with hip hop culture is racism. Doesn't have to be, but from my perspective, more often than not it seems that way.

-- Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ

by jemaleddin on Apr 25, 2008 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

That's so true cause otherwise I'll use the old "quacks like a duck, waddles like a duck...must be a duck" method.

by Kid Nate on Apr 25, 2008 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Dana White Doesn't Think MMA is a Sport Either

As one of the world's whitest people and a Canadian to boot, I admit that the BET Iron Ring show took me a little off guard and that I found it to be an MMA/unintentional humor show. Chalk that up to culture shock.

After watching the first 6-7 episodes and digesting it fully I've come to the conclusion that its concept and execution have been unique and successful.

Jeff Comstock

by Jeff Comstock on Apr 24, 2008 10:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs