Steve Cantwell Apologizes for Gloating

by Kid Nate on Dec 16, 2008 10:01 PM EST in News Comment 85 comments

Steve Cantwell talking about his fight against Razak Al-Hassan in a message sent to MMA On Tap:

“You know that was a really weird outcome to the fight. I had the arm locked in tightly and expected Razak to tap right away – then we rolled twice and it got even tighter. I was thinking to myself ‘This guy is made of rubber – this is crazy’. The only thing I could to end the fight was force the arm until either it broke or he tapped, and that’s what I did. Fighting is always a series of calculated risks, and he had ample opportunity to tap. But none of us enter the ring trying to end each others career, and I do regret the comments I made and being so animated about it afterwards. It was the adrenalin taking over.

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Apology Accepted

Adrenalin is a hell of a drug. He did seem to give him plenty of chances to tap.

by EazyEismydad on Dec 16, 2008 7:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

While I don’t believe it was as big an issue as it was made out to be, I still think it was very unsportsmanlike to gloat like that. I’m glad he apologized.

by pud333 on Dec 16, 2008 7:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Same here. Credit to him.

by Benicio on Dec 16, 2008 8:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

What an asshole!

by Michaelthebox on Dec 16, 2008 7:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

oh you love you some cantwell. You should do something about that crush..

by lbk on Dec 16, 2008 7:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

always takes balls to apologize good man

by Chuntsman949 on Dec 16, 2008 7:18 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I’d allow someone to break my arm if it means we can stop talking about this now.

by jebushchrist on Dec 16, 2008 7:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

If you say so.. Be right over.

by Blackout612 on Dec 16, 2008 9:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Still.....what a great asset to have

To have broken someone’s arm or leg or whatever has to be a great asset to have as a fighter. Do you think anyone that gets caught in an armbar from someone like Mir or (now Cantwell) won’t be tapping a little bit quicker?

I can totally understand that his comments were soaked in adrenaline but still saying you have always wanted to break someone’s arm is somewhat unsportsman like. I understand guys in the NFL chest pump and cheer when they hit a QB really hard but if that QB’s neck is possibly broke you don’t see them saying “HELL YEA! I always wanted to hit someone so hard I paralyzed them!”

Being happy over a big win is one thing, saying you WANTED to injur someone is something else.

Either way, I wasn’t that broke up over it and I think Cantwell is a big man for apoliging and I can accept it.

by Dexerion on Dec 16, 2008 7:25 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Luke said it really well on his radio show,

when he pointed out that these guys live and breathe this stuff, so all they think of is maneuvers and position. Of course these guys think about snapping an arm with the perfect armbar. It was less-than-classy for him to show his pleasure at the fact, but for him to actually want to do that at some point is the norm for these guys. I would draw a big distinction is he had made it personal, as in “I really wanted to break his arm.” That would be totally uncalled for. But for an MMA fighter to say that he’s always wanted to break an arm with an armbar is just the truth.

There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

by misterjonez on Dec 16, 2008 11:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly how I see it.

by EazyEismydad on Dec 17, 2008 5:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Whooooa!

Lets stay in the realm of reason. I get the point you’re trying to make…but lets not make a broken arm out to be the same as a broken neck.

Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Dec 17, 2008 12:17 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hmmm I really question if this apology is sincere. Something tells me one of his agents or a guy from a UFC gave him a nudge to apologize. It looks bad for the UFC if their fighters just want to break people’s bones.
His exact quote to Joe Rogan was:
“I always wanted to do that.”
Sure Steve the adrenaline made u say that. Maybe the adrenaline also made Babalu teach Heath a lesson via strangulation. I’d have more respect for him if he just admitted he was a douchebag instead of making excuses. The look in his eyes told me he thoroughly enjoyed seeing the snap and was teaching Razam a lesson.

by Sokonojudo on Dec 16, 2008 7:29 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Apology

was probably something someone told him to do,because he shouldn’t have to apologize he’s 22 years old all fired up from being in his first fight in the UFC and had an armbar his opponent should have tapped out from.What’s he supposed to do if his opponent refuses to tap out let go? I don’t understand why this was such a huge issue at all.

by tylerdurden1 on Dec 16, 2008 9:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Wow so 22 years old are exempt from being douches? Its a big deal because hes gloating at dislocating elbows. I dont care if it is his first fight or 30th fight in the UFC, he still has no right to enjoy what he did. Yes Razam didn’t tap and yes he was executing a move to win the fight but he gives fighters a bad reputation. You think NFL guys brag at press conferences at how many torn ACLs they’ve been responsible for and how they enjoy tearing ligaments.

by Sokonojudo on Dec 16, 2008 9:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You can’t even compare the NFL and MMA why are you trying? The objective of an armbar is to snap your opponents arm unless he taps.Me pointing out he’s only 22 was to give a reason as to why he may have been a little immature in some eyes.I really don’t think he was though he was happy about his win.That’s the way I took it to be.This is a fight people are going to get hurt.By the way NFL players celebrate big hits all the time.When you see them get excited after a big hit on someone do you start complaining about sportsmanship.By the time the guys are at a press conference the adrenaline has settled of course their not going to be as jacked up about a big hit like they were in the heat of the moment.The ACL’s people hurt are injury’s as a result of the contact that’s going on of course players don’t celebrate them.The comparison to that would be if Dale Hartt celebrated Cory Hill’s injury.There two very different cases Hill’s injury was accidental,Al-Hussan was hurt because he was in an armbar and didn’t tap.

by tylerdurden1 on Dec 16, 2008 10:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I should keep a template handy for reminding people the purpose of this argument.

No one cares that he broke the guys arm, it’s how he behaved after doing so.

by Blackout612 on Dec 16, 2008 10:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

OK I’ll say it again since you think I don’t understand the argument.How was his behavior so bad? He was happy about the win full of adrenaline and didn’t do anything wrong if you want to be pissed at Cantwell then get pissed at Al-Hussan who could have avoided all of this non sense if he was smart enough to figure out he was in an armbar he couldn’t get out of and he should tapout.These guys are fighting in a cage for christ sake then people are going to complain when the fighters don’t act more contrite about hurting their opponent. What a crock of shit.

by tylerdurden1 on Dec 16, 2008 10:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I thought they were fighting for paychecks

But apparently they’re fighting for Christ’s sake.

To those previously wondering, this is one of the guys I was talking about.

Please use the spacebar. Thanks for your time..

by Blackout612 on Dec 16, 2008 10:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Your attempt at humor is a complete failure, and your arrogance is nauseating. Thanks for being completely unreasonable.

by tylerdurden1 on Dec 16, 2008 10:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hm..

Wasn’t trying to be funny, but you are unintentionally so.

by Blackout612 on Dec 16, 2008 11:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Then apparently you can’t read, because when I said their fighting in a cage for christ sake you came back with the “I thought they were fighting for paychecks”. If that comment was not intended to be funny then you must have thought I literally meant the guys were fighting for christ sake. For someone being so critical of a fighters behavior you might want to think about your own.

by tylerdurden1 on Dec 16, 2008 11:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I like Fight Club.

by Blackout612 on Dec 16, 2008 11:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Aren’t there any tall buildings where you live?

by tylerdurden1 on Dec 17, 2008 12:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

So I can recreate the final scene? Ah.. How lovely..

by Blackout612 on Dec 17, 2008 12:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You can’t be more than thirteen years old. That would explain your childish responses. So from now on I’ll have to just ignore your comments on any subject. It makes no sense to keep commenting back and forth with a kid.

by tylerdurden1 on Dec 17, 2008 1:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

To be fair...

you must have thought I literally meant the guys were fighting for christ sake

Cantwell did, after the fight, attribute his breaking of another mans arm to God. I forget the exact wording, but was something like, “I thank jesus for that one”. So you may be on to something :)

by mythbuster on Dec 17, 2008 10:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The objective of an arm bar is not to break the other person’s arm. An armbar is a joint hold meant to make the other person submit. Breaking or dislocating is just a result from not submitting. Is the purpose of a rear naked choke to kill the person by strangulating them? No but it could happen if no ref was there.
His behavior is inexcusable. Being happy about a win doesn’t mean you should take pride in hurting him.He can take back his words and say it was an accident or the adrenaline all he wants. A classy individual would have said that’s part of fighting and wish the opponent a speedy recovery. He brags about how he wants to break bones and gloats about it. Maybe, he can teabag another can when he’s unconscious and say how he always wanted to do that too.

by Sokonojudo on Dec 16, 2008 10:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree with the premise

that the objective of applying an armbar is to force submission. An armbar is a crippling maneuver which is designed to break an arm, thereby reducing the relative danger of the opponent dramatically. In MMA the armbar, and every other joint lock, is prevented from accomplishing its actual purpose by the ref or the recipient of the lock. It’s a combat sport, which means there are regulations and definite objectives, but it’s still combat.

As for the RNC, it’s not designed to kill anyone. It’s designed to incapacitate the opponent. What you do with them after they’re incapacitated is up to you. You could maintain the choke and kill them with it, but that’s not the objective of a RNC, or any other choke. The goal of a choke is simply to incapacitate the opponent, and this is allowed to occur fairly often in MMA, as there has been no evidence that momentary unconsciousness due to a blood choke causes any long-term damage.

All that said, everyone agrees that it was less than the epitome of class for Cantwell to gloat about breaking his arm in the immediate aftermath of the fight.

There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

by misterjonez on Dec 16, 2008 11:15 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

Wrong

An armbar is designed to break an arm, period. The rules about tapping became the norm once grappling was codified into judo (1880s), though they had some signal for practice. The samurai who practiced ancient jujitsu probably wouldn’t give their opponents time to tap in battle.

Martial arts are rooted in war – joint locks are for crippling, chokes for asphyxiating, strikes for bludgeoning, all to the death. That’s history. The idea of referee stoppage is relatively new in the context of fighting.

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Dec 16, 2008 11:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

We aren’t fighting in the 1880s. If this were real war everyone would just eye gouge each other. In combat sports, joint locks are used as submission holds, and are intended to force the opponent to submit; the lock will be controlled and held until an opponent submits or a referee recognizes the threat of injury and intervenes.
IMO if the armbar was designed to cripple the opponent then why wouldn’t you be allowed to bend thumbs backwards and what not? Doesnt a broken thumb cripple your opponent too? Perhaps, it’s up to the person doing the manuever. Some fighters might want to break your arms and some might want you to submit.

by Sokonojudo on Dec 16, 2008 11:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It’s true that fighters aren’t supposed to snap the joint at first yank, but to say that they should just hold the limb is absurd. They know the risks of not tapping. My point is saying that “The objective of an arm bar is not to break the other person’s arm” is wrong. They don’t break it out of necessity – it’s safer, and they can’t afford to be out of action for the time it would take to heal, so they agree not to break anything unless there is no tap (cf. Saku/Renzo). It’s the rules of the game, hence “tap, nap, or snap.”

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Dec 17, 2008 12:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

IF I get you in an armbar and you disrespect me because you think it is just a hold, I will break your arm. If you start an unwanted fight with me and I get an armbar, I will break your arm and I don’t care if you tap. Plus you better stop fighting after I break your arm or my my correctional officer MMA instructor taught us how to follow up after an arm break. Maybe nerf bat fighting is more your sport?

by Dropkick434 on Dec 17, 2008 1:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Ugh.. Really?

by Blackout612 on Dec 17, 2008 1:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I was just trying to make the point that if you want to compete in a fight, you have to make a mental commitment to want to hurt someone. You have to be motivated to hurt someone. Fighters have been known to do crazy things after fights and I don’t think all the P.R. training in the world will stop future incidents like this. Adrenaline is a hell of a drug.

by Dropkick434 on Dec 17, 2008 1:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

my correctional officer MMA instructor taught us how to follow up after an arm break.

I hope it wasn’t “run around and gloat” – that doesn’t seem to be a popular option.

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Dec 17, 2008 1:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Most of his stories end " and then I cuffed him."

by Dropkick434 on Dec 17, 2008 1:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Awww…more responsible, but less exciting…

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Dec 17, 2008 2:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

weak

Tottally weak. To break someones are and then run around the ring doing arm breaking motions is just uncalled for. Not only that but he should be fined for unsportsman like conduct and suspended from the UFC.
Last thing we need is another redneck running around the UFC

Leg Locks Rule!

by jjdnb on Dec 16, 2008 7:35 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

You're insane...

Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Dec 17, 2008 12:18 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs

I think some of you guys have been taking this way too far. Yeah, the guy could have sounded a little more sportsmanlike when his opponent was injured. Then again, his opponent had the ability to tap. If you’re in a fight where you are trying to hurt the other guy and he’s trying to hurt you, and you break his arm, adrenaline is going to kick in and you’re going to be pretty amped up that you just ended it so definitively. Add into his win the fact that it was his first win in the UFC and you can see how much adrenaline must have been going through the guys head. He took it a little too far and he was a man and apologized. What more do you guys want?

by dropkick101 on Dec 16, 2008 7:48 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Taking this too far?

Taking it too far would be writing letters, d00d. Other people are allowed to voice their opinions..

by Blackout612 on Dec 16, 2008 9:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

For the record

I think Razak’s elbow popped out. It didn’t break IIRC.

He’s still a douchebag though for actually wanting to break a guy’s arm

by Discman2 on Dec 16, 2008 7:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

jesus christ, hes a kid and hes still a bit immature, that was his first fight in the UFC fighting in front of american troops……. cut the kid some slack

by Chuntsman949 on Dec 16, 2008 8:05 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

He’s 22, not a kid.

by mythbuster on Dec 16, 2008 8:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I’m 22. At 22 in the UFC, you’re still a kid. 22 is about the age most athletes break into the pros. 22 is the age most people in general step into their first real job. 22 means you’re a rookie when it comes to sports and when it comes to adult life in general. For all intents and purposes, 22 is a kid.

by dropkick101 on Dec 16, 2008 8:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Absolutely agreed! I’m in college and the twenty-somethings around here are effectively “kids.” Just because mommy and daddy don’t hold your hand anymore doesn’t mean you’re all grown up.

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Dec 16, 2008 8:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Why do people constantly defend this kind of behavior?

Can’t we just uniformly agree this kind of behavior is what turns people away from the sport?

by lbk on Dec 16, 2008 8:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

People defend it because the entire incident is being blown way out of proportion. I found his post fight remarks in poor taste, but he apologized and it’s time to move on. It’s not like he held the arm bar too long with the sole intention of breaking Al-Hassan’s arm. Cantwell made a stupid comment. There’s a big difference between saying something dumb and committing an actual foul.

by Andy R on Dec 16, 2008 9:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

No we can’t – because it doesn’t turn people away from the sport. There are athletes in every major sport who come out and say stupid shit. Look at Terrell Owens entire career. Look at Sean Avery’s entire career. Look at whats-his-face from the Braves years ago talking all that shit about minorities in New York City. These types of comments do exactly what they’re doing here – spur controversy between those who are already fans of the sport. No one looking at a UFC event for the first time is going to say, “Well that one guy seemed to be happy about injury his opponent so I’m never watching that filth again.” Plus, it’s a broken arm and it was Al-Hussan’s own fault for not tapping. Shit.

by dropkick101 on Dec 16, 2008 9:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You cry like a girl. Are you?

by Michaelthebox on Dec 17, 2008 3:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I sincerely doubt...

that the behavior turned any reasonably important number of people away from the sport. As a matter of fact the arm break itself probably has the ability to turn more people away than him afterward.

Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Dec 17, 2008 10:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The millions of 22 year olds around the world whose parents taught them to behave in society disagree with you. Being an athlete doesn’t give someone a “child forever” pass, no matter how much you would like it.

by mythbuster on Dec 17, 2008 10:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Ignore that...

that was supposed to be quoted, not bold… I will try again.

I’m 22. At 22 in the UFC, you’re still a kid. 22 is about the age most athletes break into the pros. 22 is the age most people in general step into their first real job. 22 means you’re a rookie when it comes to sports and when it comes to adult life in general. For all intents and purposes, 22 is a kid.

The millions of 22 year olds around the world whose parents taught them to behave in society disagree with you. Being an athlete doesn’t give someone a "child forever" pass, no matter how much you would like it.

by mythbuster on Dec 17, 2008 10:33 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I totally get the “wanting to do that”. Armbars are supposed to break limbs, and it’s momentarily exhilarating to fully execute one. Combined with the adrenaline, it’s an understandable, if regrettable reaction. He apologized, it’s over, moving on.

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Dec 16, 2008 8:14 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

For me, this certainly helps matters. Owning up to it is important, so good for Cantwell. He’s still very young and behaving like that can be partly attributed to that. Only partly, because age isn’t an excuse for stupidity. But good on him for recognizing his mistakes, and hopefully he can exhibit more honorable behavior in the future (at which point I may begin to forgive this incident).

by Blackout612 on Dec 16, 2008 9:00 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Only partly, because age isn’t an excuse for stupidity is right. Either way, he manned up and apologized which is more than a lot of people do when they make a mistake.

by dropkick101 on Dec 16, 2008 9:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

^^ No arguing with any of this.

There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

by misterjonez on Dec 16, 2008 11:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

he gave the guy plenty of chances to tap and he didnt and thats what happen in mma if you dont tap! he got excited but apolgized for it end of story!

by graciearmbar on Dec 16, 2008 9:31 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Arrest this man! We don't need a serial armbreaker on the loose!

Eyeroll.

by Slica on Dec 16, 2008 10:49 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

The people who are disagreeing with his antics and saying he’s eff’d up for gloating….must have never played competitive sports. After drilling a jumping receiver on his way down or running home and blasting a catcher who’s trying to tag you out is an indescribable feeling…and i betcha it’s even more intensified in this sport. You’re excited you did good, you’re excited you won, sometimes you dont realize what u say. After the emotion tho, i think any normal person starts to wonder if the person they just crushed is ok. I liked his celebratory actions after the fight…I like seein that passion in fighters, it makes for better fights!! Who wants a bunch of emotionless drones?? I wish there were more guys like Cantwell, Diaz, Lesnar. I like the cocky, gloating….however I despise fighters like Krazy Horse Bennet. And if you cant tell the difference, you should break your own arm.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 10:27 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

I wish there were more guys like Cantwell, Diaz, Lesnar. I like the cocky, gloating….however I despise fighters like Krazy Horse Bennet. And if you cant tell the difference, you should break your own arm.

Is this a black-white thing?

by mythbuster on Dec 17, 2008 10:36 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

No. It’s being happy you won VS I’m a scumbag who’s getting paid to beat ppl up. Krazy Horse Bennet could be green for all i care, he’s a lowlife.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 10:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

aah ok

So you don’t think Diaz is a lowlife.

by mythbuster on Dec 17, 2008 10:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

What makes Nick or Nate low lives? The whole Hawaii thing with Noons? I liked that…it got me amped up for the rematch with Nick and KJ, that unfortunately never happened. I think people sometimes forget this is a sport and its a fight. It’s not a ballet where everyone is nice and polite…nor can everyone be as classy as Randy. I say get fired up, talk trash about the guy you’re going to fight…and throw water bottles at peoples dads! Ok, that last part was a little much.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 10:54 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Well

for starters yeah, trying to attack a guys father in the ring and starting fights at press conferences.

But I think I see your point. If you, personally, like it – then its ok. Otherwise the person is a lowlife. You are the judge of all things holy and all things lowlife.

by mythbuster on Dec 17, 2008 11:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

And after being a fan of this site for a few months now, I see you’re judge\jury\executioner on all members and their comments.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 11:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

But the question...

which only you can answer – am I lowlife or not?

* crosses fingers! *

by mythbuster on Dec 17, 2008 11:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh. I like ur comments. Honestly, I was hoping for some more venom. Like eventually making fun of my mom or something =(

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 11:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Yay!

by mythbuster on Dec 17, 2008 11:22 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

And yes...

After each fight and interview, I do see Nick Diaz getting closer and closer to the bar Krazy Horse hangs out at.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I'm glad

he appologized. He seems like he has a brigh future in the sport and I would hate to see everything he has accomplished so far and what will happen in the near future overshadowed by some stupid comments made in the excitement of his first win on the sports biggest stage.

by Razreshat on Dec 17, 2008 10:59 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

I dont get it. Why would what he said jeopardize anything?!?! He said he wanted to break an arm for the past 5 yrs…GOOD! He’s a fighter!!! You need to have that killer instinct. The fact of the matter is when you step into a cage, it’s you VS someone who’s trying to bash your head in.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 11:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I didn’t say jeopardize…his career would go on…but that comment has gotten a hell of alot more attention that his strong performance…hence, overshadowing his accomplishments.

I do think its fair to take issue with a fighter’s character when that fighter WANTS to injure another fighter. In this case specifically, Cantwell had to do it because his opponent wasn’t tapping when he should have…so fine, he broke/dislocated the arm as a necessity. However, wanting to do it is another factor all together.

by Razreshat on Dec 17, 2008 11:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I see what you’re saying…how the great fight got overshadowed by some basically irrelevant comments. But just think, how scared is his next opponent going to be of getting armbar’d?? I betcha he’d tap in a matter of milliseconds.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 11:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

-Nothing wrong with “breaking” an arm.
-nothing wrong with choking a fighter out.
-nothing wrong with knocking a fighter out.

-nothing wrong with celebrating a victory.

-everything wrong with being disrespectful, not showing appreciation and concern for your opponent.

in other words, it wasn’t Cantwell’s arm dislocation, or even his celebration afterward, fueled by adrenaline and excitement, or even his comment about always wanting to do something along those lines. It was the complete lack of respect or concern towards his opponent that turned many people off of him. It isn’t about being in love with the other fighter, lol, it is about having some class, being a good winner and a showing sportsmanship.

If he had won, run around like he did, as if he had just beat the greatest fighter on Earth, made his comment about wanting to break an arm AND THEN SAID, “I hope my opponent will be ok, he was game and I appreciate him getting in here and fighting me”, I think this whole thing could have been avoided. Unfortunately, he just isn’t that guy.

Eliot Marshall: Bader won. Like I said in the episode, I'm not going to make any excuses. It's my job to be able to deal with when somebody's doing that. It's not his job to change up his tactics.

http://eliotmarshall.com/

by BJJDenver on Dec 17, 2008 11:16 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Dont you think for some fighters, especially young ones, it MIGHT be a LITTLE hard to thank a guy who was just trying to knock you out or choke you unconscious?? I think the whole “being able to seperate the fight from the sport” comes later on with experience. Personally, if I were to get into a fight with someone over a parking spot at the mall…If i’m victorious, I really dont think after the fight I’m going to thank him
for coming to that mall that day, driving with great skill and giving an overall valiant effort on trying to get the spot…..

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 11:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

lol, c’mon, I know you are just using that as an example, but fighting for a parking spot and being a professional fight in a fast growing sport, are way different. And that must be one Hell of a spot!

Seriously, I know it is a valid reaction, but you can’t excuse this because of his age. Cantwell has been around and even held a title in one of the major promotions. I actually like him as a fighter, which is one reason his behavior irritated me so much. To fight on that level, you must be able to step out of your zone after the fight and show some maturity, imo. Now. I’m not saying he is akin to Osama or anything, just that in an instance where he had a chance to represent himself and the sport in a great fashion, he chose to be totally classless.

many of these fighters talk about the warrior spirit, compare themselves to great combatants and leaders in history. When defeating their opponents, many of those great warriors showed respect and honor, even when killing their opponents.

Eliot Marshall: Bader won. Like I said in the episode, I'm not going to make any excuses. It's my job to be able to deal with when somebody's doing that. It's not his job to change up his tactics.

http://eliotmarshall.com/

by BJJDenver on Dec 17, 2008 11:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Ok, I know it was a wacky example. All i’m saying is I’m such a fan of this sport because of its ability to stay raw and have purity. Fighters who legitimately want to fight…and with fighting comes hurting people, no way around it. If you watch football, bball, or any sport really…it’s all about the money now, not about the game. Everything is money, contracts and sponsors. It’s so superficial. When I see a UFC fighter, makin 8k a fight, jump up and celebrate like a mad man…that shows me he puts in 110% and is going to give it his all – thus making for better fights….because its not about the money. Its about the sport.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 11:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

No, on that point, I am absolutely with you. It is pure, and such an individual mental and physical challenge. I train and unfortunately, I know all to well about getting injured, as most of the people do in here. But if my opponent hurt me and then acted like that, it would be pretty upsetting and that is when we see things like back room fighting, corners brawling and so on. As fun as it is to discuss that crazy stuff, i just don’t see much of a place for it .

Last competition I did, I lost on points, but my opponent was injured. First thing i did was go over and help him up and raise his hand. Now, of course I would rather have done that in victory, but there is a certain amount of fulfillment in showing respect and honor. He was the better man at that moment and I congratulated him and went back to make my game better.

Eliot Marshall: Bader won. Like I said in the episode, I'm not going to make any excuses. It's my job to be able to deal with when somebody's doing that. It's not his job to change up his tactics.

http://eliotmarshall.com/

by BJJDenver on Dec 17, 2008 12:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Then ur a better man than I, my friend. I would have put my hand out, as to help him up…then quickly pulled it back and ran it thru my hair, as to notion I was far far superior than he. Then kicked him in the groin.

by Gogoplatapus on Dec 17, 2008 12:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

lol, I’ll try that next time!!

As for Cantwell, he did what he did and it is over. He apologized and I’m willing to accept that and let his future actions speak for themselves and not condemn him over what i consider to be one classless example.

Eliot Marshall: Bader won. Like I said in the episode, I'm not going to make any excuses. It's my job to be able to deal with when somebody's doing that. It's not his job to change up his tactics.

http://eliotmarshall.com/

by BJJDenver on Dec 17, 2008 3:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

There's some real sickos who post here

… and who practise jiu-jitsu, which is a sad, sad statement on the current status of that great sport and martial art.

by klown on Dec 17, 2008 11:30 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

I think I see the point you are getting at, and the loss of some of the respect and tradition from TMAs, is saddening. Much of the respect, honor and tradition are being wiped away.

Eliot Marshall: Bader won. Like I said in the episode, I'm not going to make any excuses. It's my job to be able to deal with when somebody's doing that. It's not his job to change up his tactics.

http://eliotmarshall.com/

by BJJDenver on Dec 17, 2008 11:33 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs