Gina Carano Should Be in the UFC

by Michael Rome on Nov 19, 2008 4:49 PM EST in News Comment 41 comments

While the internet celebrates Dana White's change of mood regarding Gina Carano, I remain very skeptical of the plan to bring her to the WEC. For better or worse, the WEC is a novelty promotion. Due to its lack of exposure and funds, it doesn't get much attention, which is why the followup to Urijah Faber vs. Jens Pulver did just half as well as that fight.

Enter Gina Carano, the third biggest free television draw in MMA history, behind Tito Ortiz and Kimbo Slice. She may even be bigger than Tito, because she drew ratings completely on her own as opposed to being in a big title fight or in a big grudge match built over months on a reality show. Not only were her gains unbelievable, they came mostly in the target demographic of males 18-34.

So here's the question: why in the world do you take the third biggest TV draw in MMA history and put her on a show where the maximum possible rating is probably something like a 1.2? It makes no sense, it's a complete waste, and it's reeks of condescension. There is no reason to "test the waters." The waters have been tested, and women's MMA passed with flying colors.

I was at UFC 91, and during a break between fights I got up to get a drink, and saw Carano entering with a group toward her seats. She was absolutely mobbed by adoring fans, the same fans who would certainly accept her fighting in the UFC. Surely there is room when UFC cards are filled with fights like Cheick Kongo vs. Mustapha Al-Turk.

If they really need to "test the waters," they should do Carano vs. Santos on the Spike TV special scheduled for February 7th. In the main event, it will outdraw just about anything they can do in that spot.

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I agree, but...

…I’m actually interested in the Al-turk/Kongo fight. Being unfamiliar with the Cage Rage HW champion, I’m hoping he can add some depth to the UFC HW division.

Back to the topic at hand – I’m glad Dana’s at least changed his mind enough to consider her in WEC, and if they want WEC on PPV in 2009, the only way to make that successful is with Gina vs Cyborg headlining. After the last WEC event, all their top names lost.

But yes, Gina deserves to be showcased in the UFC, even if only on this “trial” basis.

Keep Swillin',
Bruz

by Bruz on Nov 19, 2008 4:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

To bring more attention to the WEC.

by iiowyn on Nov 19, 2008 4:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Seeing as the company has virtually zero advertising budget and cannot even make Urijah a draw despite a year straight worth of effort’s, I’d say it’s pretty much a gigantic waste of time and resources.

by Michael Rome on Nov 19, 2008 5:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The draw is already there apparently for Gina, and I imagine mantaining attention is easier than keeping it in this case. Zuffa is not treating the WEC as some sort of feeder league for the UFC, they are trying to actually have it as a slightly different product. There needs to be something to draw people to watch it. Quite a shame actually, the fights in WEC have pretty much all been exciting.

This could also be a holding action until enough female fighters appear for Dana to be OK with making a division in the UFC.

by iiowyn on Nov 19, 2008 5:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I’ve had this thought in relation to Miguel Torres who would undoubtedly earn more money and viewers in the UFC.

But the UFC has too many good fighters for so many divisions, and is it worth dooming the WEC to be minor-league or gone altogether by moving everything worthwhile up to the big show?

This could be the spark the WEC needs, Carano + BW + FW create a solid differentiated product for the WEC. I think a slow build trial period of about a year (3-4 fights) with Carano in the WEC would be good for both sides.

by bigweeze on Nov 19, 2008 5:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I’m fine with the OP, I just want top-tier womens MMA on TV, I can get UFC content on Spike and WEC content on TSN here so I’m fine with either. It just seems to me that you can’t cut out nearly 1/2 of the weight classes in the WEC and not add something to make up what went missing.

by pr0cs on Nov 19, 2008 5:01 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I have a major problem with calling the WEC a “novelty promotion” and down playing Cheick Kongo vs. Mustapha Al-Turk. The UFC can hardly keep up with there large roster of fighter. They are at about full tilt on show frequency and the WEC is a great answer to where to put womens MMA. Sure Gina is a star, but if you want womens MMA then you need more then the “Gina Weight class”. It just won’t fit in UFC.

by szucconi on Nov 19, 2008 5:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

i thought this was going to be a joke about how gina probably cant make 145 so she should go to the UFC

by dumbwhiteguy on Nov 19, 2008 5:06 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Sorry Michael, she is slated to be the top draw for ZombieXC. And why you gotta be takin bread out of Al-Turk’s kid’s mouths?

by smoogy on Nov 19, 2008 5:10 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Hmmm, good points, there are many precedents of zombies catching and grabbing a hold of hot women.

by iiowyn on Nov 19, 2008 5:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I buy every UFC PPV, but if they start wasting air time on women’s MMA I won’t be ordering any more.

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Nov 19, 2008 5:20 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

That’s kind of textbook sexism, isn’t it? This isn’t like the difference between men’s and women’s basketball – the sport is still exciting, they use the same size gloves and the same rules… all they need is five minute rounds and I’m fully behind Women’s MMA as a legitimate counterpart to the male side.

Until, of course, a woman MMA fighter pulls a Michelle Wie or Annika Sorenstam and wants to compete against the men – good thing we have athletic commissions that would never let that happen.

That said, if I were a newly unemployed Gina, I’d a)stare at myself in the mirror in lingere all day and b) be pretty fucking psyched about being on WEC.

by subo on Nov 19, 2008 6:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Female athletes just aren’t the same caliber athletes that male athletes are. Also, I despise the three minute rounds. Get rid of the three minute rounds and I might change my mind about watching it.

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Nov 19, 2008 6:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Women's MMA does have the potential to be one of,

if not THE best arenas for women to produce an equally entertaining product. Boxing is too restricted, and women simply can’t generate enough power (as a group) to provide for exciting fist-fights. The small gloves help, but when you factor in the ground game, it really does allow for women to succeed, and really to shine.

I am normally a ‘sexist’ when it comes to women’s sports, because as Richard says, they just aren’t the same caliber athletes as men. They’re not built for killing the bear. I’ve tried watching many different women’s sports, and outside of tennis there is absolutely zero allure for me – except when it comes to MMA.

I agree about the five minute rounds. Make them get in shape for this and perform just like the men do, cardio-wise. But if my choice was women’s MMA with three minute rounds or no women’s MMA, I take the three minute rounds.

There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

by misterjonez on Nov 19, 2008 11:46 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

You make a compelling argument. I’ll have to think about it.

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Nov 20, 2008 12:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I know a female fighter, with quite a few fights under her belt, who is trying to set up a fight against a man in the same weight class for one reason and one reason only: she can’t get a fight against any other women. Not enough promotions with a dedicated women’s division to be willing to put on a fight between her and a similar caliber fighter, and all the less-experienced women in her weight class are scared of her and won’t fight her. What else is she supposed to do?

by AJB on Nov 19, 2008 6:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I have a friend – male – that cannot find an opponent at 135 lbs.

He’s not allowed to call out women.

They’re built differently. I’m all for equality, an Obama voter, pro-choice, let her buy dinner – but men and women cannot directly compete against each other in physical combat. She is, sadly, supposed to do what my buddy is doing – bide time, train, get better and wait.

by subo on Nov 19, 2008 7:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Another Gina column?, man i’d rather people make a hundred Fedor threads than another useless article about how Gina is a draw (which she isn’t) and should be in the UFC.

by Raker on Nov 19, 2008 5:22 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Nice blanket comment that she isn’t a draw. Do you have some kind of explanation for the television numbers from EXC which demonstrate that she is, in fact, a huge draw? Or do you just rely on your own gut feeling in concluding that she’s not?

by Kierkegaard on Nov 19, 2008 5:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Also, if you really consider the WEC a novelty promotion, doesn’t that make it the perfect destination for Gina?

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Nov 19, 2008 5:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I don't, actually

Sorry to respond to both of yours, but I see WEC as the premiere league for fighters 145 and under. If you add women to that mix, that’s a legit organization – not a freak show.

by subo on Nov 19, 2008 6:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I don’t consider the WEC a novelty promotion either. As you stated, it is the premiere league for featherweight and bantamweight. I don’t think adding women will make it more legitimate, but if it draws more eyes to the likes of Faber and Torres I’ll take it.

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Nov 19, 2008 6:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think that's exactly what it would do, Richard.

And that’s why I’m totally for it. Right now, the ‘little guys’ aren’t given any legitimacy because they are viewed as a bit of a freak show or whatever by the mainstream audience. Put Gina in there, more eyeballs tune in, and you create more fans when Faber or Torres take the ring. Plus we get to see Gina fight, which most of us will admit is a very good opportunity for entertainment, as well.

There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

by misterjonez on Nov 19, 2008 11:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I’m all for it if that is the result.

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Nov 20, 2008 12:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree that Carano and a full female division (eventually several) deserve to be in the UFC in that they deserve the most prestigious and visible platform to ply their wears. That said, I I think that the WEC’s bantamweights and featherweights deserve to be there just as much, if not more, given their greater depth.

by Rundownloser on Nov 19, 2008 5:25 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Hmmm…what if Zuffa is trying to push the WEC as their first foray onto network television? I personally think it would be the best promotion to do so as it is the most professional sports appearing of all the promotions I have seen. Less spectacle more fight, and the lighter weights really bring the action. Zuffa might be a bit more amenable to letting the networks have a bit of control since it isn’t their main show. Getting Carano would be a huge boon for that.

Just speculatin’

by iiowyn on Nov 19, 2008 5:35 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Hmmm…what if Zuffa is trying to push the WEC as their first foray onto network television?

Interesting… People have been speculating about how the WEC would do on ppv, but maybe that was never the plan. Hmmmmmm indeed.

by mythbuster on Nov 19, 2008 8:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hadn’t really coalesced the thought until reading these posts. Interesting indeed.

There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

by misterjonez on Nov 19, 2008 11:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I’m not sure how much of a benefit Gina will be to UFC over WEC. It’s true, more marketing dollars are put behind the flagship brand, but then what people would really be tuning in to see would be a result of the UFC’s promotion rather than Gina’s self-created drawing power.

Besides, why not strengthen the weaker brand with a legitimate star? Now that the WEC has eliminated two divisions while simultaneously increasing their schedule from 6 shows per year to 8, they could use the addition to their talent pool. I can see the benefit of adding eyes to a Fight Night, but I’m not sure the benefit is that much greater than doing the same with a WEC event.

We’re talking basic cable either way, which is to say that expecting her do draw the same audience she did on network television is probably wishful thinking. Point being that it’s not going to offer such a big difference in viewership that ZUFFA will be likely to afford themselves new advertising opportunities.

And when it comes to PPV buys, we just don’t know if anyone is willing to pay to watch Gina fight above and beyond the typical UFC offering. I believe it’s possible, but I would advise that what people will watch for free is not necessarily what they are willing to pay for. Which is to say that I don’t see Gina being a great boon the the UFC’s already healthy buyrates at this time.

by Brett Jones on Nov 19, 2008 5:49 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

For me, women’s MMA is not on the same level as men’s.

I would not want a good men’s fight moved off the card for 3×3 minute rounds. Aren’t gassed fighters and sloppy kickboxing what we complain about here?

by bigweeze on Nov 19, 2008 5:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Yep

Brett hit it on the head here. I would prefer Gina AND a women’s MMA division in the WEC.

http://mma4real.net/

by Tha Realness on Nov 19, 2008 8:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Nobody watches the UFC for Gina...

However, Gina may draw more people over to the WEC.

by cyph on Nov 19, 2008 5:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I gotta agree. Make a womens division of like 130-145lb. Allows a fairly wide variety of female fighters. Make Gina and some other (Larosa) fight for a title. Then build up the Gina vs Cyborg for a co-main draw under the UFC banner.

by Tommy7 on Nov 19, 2008 6:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Set For Life

Gina Carano is beautiful, and has a vagina. No matter what’s next for her in life she’s set. She doesn’t need to fight another day in her life, some guy will take care of her. Women have it too good. Beautiful with a vagina(no matter what horrible repulsive personality) you’re set for life. Not like that for men, we have to put up with womens bullshit and there’s no guarantee.

by Devil Beest on Nov 19, 2008 6:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I hate to admit it

But the man’s right – being born a hot, white girl in 21st century America is like hitting the intergenerational jackpot.

by subo on Nov 19, 2008 6:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Let’s not get too carried away as to be degrading.

by Cannon Jacques on Nov 19, 2008 7:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Yes and No

Gina Carano has certainly earned a spot in the UFC as has women’s MMA. However, if that is the case then the lower weight classes deserve to be there as well.
We need the WEC to do well so the 145 and 135 weight classes have a home in the US where there is consistent top competition. Gina needs to be added to the WEC so it gets that extra draw that she has proven. People are looking to the WEC to save women’s fighting, but women’s fighting would be saving the WEC.
Eventually down the road you can have women’s divisions in both. For now the guy’s that are Gina’s size need her to market for their events.

by EazyEismydad on Nov 19, 2008 6:57 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I’m all for any free fights, and if they are good fights – all the better.

You say that she is the #3 MMA draw, but I don’t know… would the same people who tuned in to CBS to watch her fight also buy a PPV just to watch her, or any of the other female fights that a division needs to produce? I think many would not. The drunken “lets watch the hot chic fight” crowd wouldn’t shell out the money for her alone, I think.

I think the WEC is a much better fit for an emerging division that needs quite a bit of work to get it going.

by mythbuster on Nov 19, 2008 8:22 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Good point, myth.

Gina might be the #3 most powerful draw overall among MMA fighters, but how much of her audience is the actual target audience? Is there a difference? My own limited experience says that audiences are pretty similar, even when you think they might be wildly different.

It’s an interesting question, though. If Gina is only a draw because all the drunk frat-boys called up their friends and family, telling them to flip to CBS “Cuz there’s this TOTALLY HOT CHICK who’s about to kick some ass,” then it changes things pretty dramatically. At least if you’re trying to come up with her PPV impact. Her cable viewership impact would probably directly translate from the network impact.

There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

by misterjonez on Nov 19, 2008 11:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

WEC might be a much bigger draw if it were on a basic cable channel. Let’s not forget its on an upper tier channel that I had never even heard of before I wanted to watch the WEC.

I had to upgrade a package to get Versus, and I was not on the bottom tier in the first place. I have no doubt that if you stuck that on Spike or ESPN that viewership would double in short order.

by toxic on Nov 19, 2008 8:27 PM EST reply actions 0 recs