Anderson Silva vs. Chuck Liddell at UFC 95?
by Luke Thomas on Nov 17, 2008 11:58 AM EST
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SunSport understands Middleweight champion Anderson Silva, 33, has been asked to appear on the card, with a potential bout with light heavyweight star Chuck Liddell already being mooted.
That potentially mouthwatering clash would see The Spider step up to the 205lbs division to face 38-year-old Liddell - who is desperate to get back on the victory trail following his devastating loss to Rashad Evans at UFC 88.
Liddell was slated to fight Mauricio 'Shogun' Rua at UFC 85 but injuries to both men put that clash on ice.
And with Rua set to face Mark Coleman in Ireland at UFC 93, a Liddell v Silva clash looks a real possibility.
A raft of British fighters will be asked to appear on the UFC 95 bill, with welterweight star Dan Hardy already keen to be involved.
However, Michael Bisping will NOT be part of the line up as he will be filming season nine of The Ultimate Fighter.
Beyond satisfying some sort of fantasy itch and trying to sell lots of tickets, this seems like a very strange and dangerous fight for Liddell. Dynamic strikers with excellent movement on the outside who throw smart combinations with a premium on placement are kryptonite for Liddell's style. I certainly see the appeal in this fight, but at this stage in his career matching Liddell with Anderson Silva does not seem to me a way for the UFC to maximize Liddell's remaining talents. Let's see if this rumor has any validity.
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me too.
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by Anton Tabuena on Nov 17, 2008 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
Man I hope this is not true.
I love Liddell just like I do Randy but they are both done & I do not want to be remembering the Spider kneeing him into oblivion for one of his last fights. This would have been a great match a few years ago.
I agree with you
I am just fine with the last image I have of Chuck being him sleeping soundly face down on the mat.
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
(crossposted)
I can’t imagine this happening, and I agree it shouldn’t happen at all. While fanbois may want to see it, it serves no purpose and there can be no winner. If Silva wins – Chucks career is dead and Silva beat a guy who was on the downslide anyway. If Chuck wins – he beat a guy from a lower weightclass and Silva couldn’t beat a guy on the downslide.
And if, for some reason, they do book this match I can’t see why it would be put on the London card. It would be either an afternoon for North America, or a very late night for Europe. Either way they would lose money on a gimmick fight that people would pay to watch.
Actually it’s the opposite. He signed on to fight Shogun there, and then made the trip over even when he didnt fight.
by Michael Rome on Nov 17, 2008 1:19 PM EST up reply actions
Even though I know Chuck
says he will fight anyone, I hope that someone in his camp talks some sense into him if he is considering this. Chuck & Randy are my 2 favorite fighters & I hate the way the end of both of their careers has been going.
Anderson must be serious about this retirement thing. It’s just going to be megafights from now on, plausible or not.
by Derek Suboticki on Nov 17, 2008 11:41 AM EST reply actions
he has to defend his MW belt too. So i guess unless a clear cut quality contender emerges then he has at least 1 not-so-mega fight. haha.
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by Anton Tabuena on Nov 17, 2008 11:45 AM EST up reply actions
I hope they sign Cung Le. I think he’s ready for the big show.
by Derek Suboticki on Nov 17, 2008 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
i think he’s busy making movies that are sure to flop. haha. :D
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by Anton Tabuena on Nov 17, 2008 10:53 PM EST up reply actions
Please dont do it
I agree, there is no upside to this fight. Do you want an aging former star to knockout the guy that some call the greatest pound for pound fighter in the world? In turn, do you want to further tarnish the reputation of one of the greatest LHW fighters the UFC has ever seen?
Bring back Tito, let Chuck pound his face in one more time, then they can both retire.
Read My Blog
"Life's tough, tougher if you're stupid."
Great idea
@ Chuck and Tito fighting again.
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
Put Tito against Anderson
"My job is a decision-making job, and as a result, I make a lot of decisions." --George W. Bush, The Decider, Lancaster, Pa., Oct. 3, 2007
by lovingmma25 on Nov 17, 2008 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
I hope this happens. Who else should Chuck fight? A rematch with Jardine? A steel cage match against the Rock? A drinking contest with David Spade on pay-per-view for $49.95? No. The answer is a fight with Anderson Silva.
Nonsense
He can still fight. You don’t have to be an obvious title contender to continue on. If that were the case, half the UFC should just hang em up..
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
Not at all what I mean,
but Chuck in his prime would have walked thru Jardine, Evans. When your skills diminish there is not any real interest in seeing you face a younger dominant fighter, other than PPV. There comes a time for every fighter, athlete where you simply cannot compete at the same level you once did & you do not match up well against younger, faster fighters who in your prime you could have.
I really don’t like how you discredit the competitors that face your favorite fighters, and merely chalk it up to age. It’s all hypothetical. Rashad has developed into an extremely dangerous fighter. To so matter of factly insist that he couldn’t beat Chuck five years ago is purely conjecture. Give the guy some credit (+Jardine, +Brock)..
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
Not at all what I said, read again.
I said that Chuck “in his prime” would have walked thru those guys. That is more about his dominance than discrediting those guys. They have developed into better fighters but to think that Chuck would have missed the connection opportunities presented in those fights is not right. Are you comparing Jardine/Evans to Couture or any of the other guys Liddell faced during his run? Chuck was a split second late multiple times in those fights & it ultimately resulted in a KO when he faced Evans.
The difference is...
..I don’t think Chuck has changed. Not one bit. People have figured him out. That’s my opinion. He’s still very viable and he can still beat a lot of guys. He could be a top contender again if he works on protecting his chin and being less erratic with his inside striking (ie; get rid of that uppercut).
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 12:22 PM EST up reply actions
That is certainly true,
but aging has definitely diminished those skills he has relied upon until now. His not changing or evolving is a factor but the same opportunities were there in those fights & he missed his window. Look at the Evans fight, Rashad beat him to the punch. In Liddell’s prime, Evans probably would have been on his back instead of the other way around. To discount the speed of younger fighters is never good, just ask Chuck.
On Brock,
I have been preaching about how potentially good Brock could be & that is why I did not want Randy to face him. It was an extremely bad matchup for Couture.
I’m just having trouble remembering you saying that Randy would lose. I’m just all about giving these guys credit with they win. Same with Randy, should he have won. I would have been upset at the notion that Brock is “raw” and Randy should have won all along. Brock won. He’s the winner. And he did so in devestating fashion. That’s my conclusion.
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 12:24 PM EST up reply actions
I did not
address that on this post because the fight has already happened. Go back & look at the posts leading up to the fight. I said that I thought Randy had basically no chance against Brock unless he sub’d him or somehow got the fight into late rounds. Brock just had his 4th fight, to say that he is not raw no matter the outcome of the fight is a little ridiculous.
Twisting
It was a dual implication. I said the idea that someone could say Randy winning (should he have done so) is meaningless because Brock is raw, would be unfair & discrediting.
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 12:37 PM EST up reply actions
Not twisting at all,
other than Lesnar’s size what advantage did he have against Randy? Couture was fighting a guy with 3 prof fights with the same background he has.
What?
Look what I said and the situation I posed. That’s that. The comment had two associations. The rest of that, it’s mindless. What advantage did he have? Come on with the hypothetical bullshit… It’s over dude.
The fact
that Randy has been fighting profesionally in MMA for years & Lesnar for 2 (3 fights) & that means Couture has learned many new & important aspects of MMA compared to wrestling is not hypothetical bullshit, it is fact. This is basic stuff.
Basic.... stuff?
I love when dudes on the internetz get condescending for lack of a realistic argument.
You can’t quantify how or why Brock won the fight. That’s basic stuff. This is what we call a matter of opinion. You’re a Randy mark; self admitted, no less. I am an MMA fan— I actually like Brock and Randy a great deal— both of them. You think that knowledge is all it takes to succeed in MMA? Tell that to Jorgey Gurgel. Tell that to Dean Lister when Okami kicks his face off. Don’t be so matter of fact…. when something… is not a matter of fact.
Again,
you should re-read my posts. I like Randy & Brock very much, I am simply intelligent enough to know why Randy was not going to win that fight even though everyone pointed all of those reasons why he should. You are responding to someone else or something man. Read what I wrote. I spent a couple of days last week on here debating why I knew Brock was going to win on Saturday even though I like Randy very much & you can absolutely quantify why he lost. I have never said anything about knowledge being the way to win fights. What I said was that was one of the reaons given by people why Randy should win. Let’s just say that it sounds like we both basically agree or agree to disagree because you keep going off on these tangents. Seriously, I enjoyed the discussion though.
Don’t worry, my balls don’t hurt. I just don’t like guys getting discredited for emerging victorious. These fighters put in a ton of hard work and I find any shrugging at their accomplishments bothersome. Bisping winning a fight against Chainsaw Charles? Yeah, that’s pretty much where I start getting critical of victories. Brock defeating Couture (who is a top 5 heavy today, at 45 or 60 or 19) is a major accomplishment. I just can’t agree with anyone saying “Well, whatever, he should have won”.
Randy looked great and he got caught.
Last time,
I never ever said Brock should have won. I said I knew he would win. Not underplaying Couture, but he is 45 years old & 50-60 lbs lighter. If he was 35 I would give him a lot better chance to win. As much as I love Randy, he did not look good at all. He has spent the entire time before this fight talking about how Brock’s wrestling was not going be good enough to beat his & how he was a better striker than Lesnar is. Exactly at what point during this fight did he look good? Remember, this a Randy mark saying this. Like I have said this entire time, this was a bad matchup for Randy from the get go.
P.S. stating that I believe Chuck Liddell in his prime probably beats Jardine or Evans handily is not discrediting to them. It is a statement about how dominant he was. Simply saying someone got caught is way more disrespectful. Randy was eating knees & elbows during that fight & what happened was inevitable with a man that size.
He did get caught
he was in the process of avoiding the punch, then the punch grazed him – that counts as getting caught – Chuck getting KO by Rashad was not getting caught
"My job is a decision-making job, and as a result, I make a lot of decisions." --George W. Bush, The Decider, Lancaster, Pa., Oct. 3, 2007
So just so I am clear:
a fighter getting KO’d by one punch is not getting caught. But the guy who was dazed previously & then dropped & then hammered into the canvas is getting caught? Is that accurate? Surely your opinion of this is not biased against Chuck Liddell, right? lol
I thought I was clear as in how he was caught – the gnp is not part of what I was describing. We can clearly see that Brock didn’t have a target when he was throwing that punch and that Randy was moving out of the way. I referenced Chuck Liddell b/c he is always using that excuse when referring to his lost against Rashad – when Rashad when for that like 10 times.
"My job is a decision-making job, and as a result, I make a lot of decisions." --George W. Bush, The Decider, Lancaster, Pa., Oct. 3, 2007
Of course
he had a target, what is he doing punching into the air & hoping that Randy is going to be there? If Randy had not moved out of the way the fight probably would have been over right there. So Chuck getting beat to the punch is not getting caught but Randy being unable to fully avoid a punch is? Very logical.
lol
like I said guy, I really did enjoy discussing this and believe that we basically have the same opinions/views about this. It seems that neither one of us are deciphering each other very well though.
Anyone else reading these exchanges feel like it’s like watching a schizophrenic poster with two screen-names arguing with himself?
(Not saying it is — just that it feels that way!)
by Kierkegaard on Nov 18, 2008 3:38 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
maybe the winner of coleman/shogun and/or a rematch with wandy. maybe even the winner of hendo/franklin or thiago/machida, hell even vera (in the philippines so it would surely sell). Those could be high profile fights that could revive his career if he wins them. I think he still has a chance of getting to the top again. Its far from a sure thing cause those guys are good, but that way has a better chance to get there than feeding him to silva.
oh and Forrest vs Chuck would be a good superfight between top draws but he has to get quality wins first to get the title shot, unless forrest loses then they can fight.
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by Anton Tabuena on Nov 17, 2008 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, Forrest losing would set that up. Otherwise, I don’t see it happening. Then Rashad could face Machida..
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 11:59 AM EST up reply actions
If all the UFC wants is immediate $$$, then book silva vs couture instead.
THey could market it as silva having trouble with wrestlers, and couture is coming down from heavyweight and silva rising to LHW. Both are good in the clinch. i still think that silva would win that but at least couture could have his farewell megafight since he’s already 45.
Let chuck fight those i mentioned above. Dont feed him to silva and force retirement on him.
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Nov 17, 2008 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
I'm guessing
Silva would annihilate Randy with outside striking and clinch-work. Randy’s dirty boxing is really good, but Silva can put his knee on his own ear. Without swinging his leg. He’s just a physically gifted guy who knows how to maximize his gifts, and I don’t know that Randy could get to him prior to getting KO’d.
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
by misterjonez on Nov 17, 2008 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
Silva’s clinch would nutrilize Randy’s dirty boxing/cage control, particularly at 205 (because of how smallish he was at 220).
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
I think Silva vs pretty much anyone is a recipe for making the anyone in the equation look bad. Some middleweights are emerging and I think Silva should spend his time there. When he’s too bored/cleans house— simply vacate and take on these 205 super fights. That’s my take..
by Blackout612 on Nov 17, 2008 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
Let's Do It
I believe Chuck is a viable opponet for Silva.
You have to think that his last 3 losses were oppenents who Chuck underestimated, but more importantly, wasn’t exited to fight . When he was faced with a challenge that exited him, by the name of Wanderlei Silva, he showed up to fight and won!
I believe that if this fight happens, and Chuck gets’s exited/nervous and prepares, he has equal opportunity to defeat Anderson Silva. I know Silva has pinpoint accuracy and blinding speed…but you can’t forget Chuck’s not to slow to throw, he does it at angles, and he has serious power that could hurt anyone.
Icenman vs. the Spider
I think that this is a bad match for Chuck.It would be a shame to see him forced into retirement from a devistating tKO loss at he hands(knees} of the Spider.
I like the fight. If Chuck can shoot in for takedowns like against Wand, he can keep Anderson a bit off balance and can make things interesting.
I don’t really get the new trend of complaining about super fights. First it was St. Pierre vs. Penn and now this. What would you rather have for either guy at this point?
Randy Couture vs. the winner (likely Anderson) would be even more exciting.
But wouldn’t Chuck be a bit more hesitant to shoot in against a BJJ blackbelt than he was against Wand? This would be a super draw no doubt, but I would have been more excited if both of these fighters were at their peaks when they met. Unless Chuck is willing to change his gameplan this seems to be a really bad matchup. Couture on the other hand I am sure would be able to gameplan something against Silva, but getting KO’d by Lesnar does not bode well for him against Silva who is lightning fast & accurate.
Oh,
sorry I just have never seen any evidence of this in his fights. But after seeing Hendo get choked out by Da Spider it seems he is a little more willing to use his than Wand is.
Wandy has the Gurgel mentality, he just happens to be able to win fights because he is such a good fighter on his feet.
Yeah I guess,
but I think that having a black belt in BJJ & being a practicing BJJ black belt are two totally different things. It seems that most every fighter that comes out of Brazil has a black belt in BJJ, but some guys pretty much are only BJJ players & others are basically strikers.
I’m not against super fights. I’m not really against this one either, but I certianly don’t see it as best use of exisitng resources. Super fights are supposed to have some sort allure based on suspense. This has very little of that and Liddell doesn’t have the guard passing or GNP to make this interesting even if he does get the takedown. It doesn’t have any of the luster Penn vs. GSP does, by contrast.
I mean, if the UFC wants to do this because Liddell won’t take the title anytime soon and because Silva is bored, ok. But this doesn’t blow my skirt up.
Great points,
my thoughts exactly. Not to mention I already have a bad enough taste in my mouth after seeing Chuck laying on the floor at the hands of Evans.
Ok, I think the fight has more intrigue than you do. I don’t believe Silva can get the clinch with Chuck, and it would be his first UFC fight without a gigantic reach advantage unless I’m forgetting one. I think he’d be facing an ultra motivated Liddell too, and it’s clear Liddell is completely different when he cares about his opponent.
by Michael Rome on Nov 17, 2008 1:20 PM EST up reply actions
Man do I hope that you are right,
I would love to see a competitive match between these two. I am just not so interested to see Chuck on the mat again. Those are good points & if this fight happens hopefully that is a difference maker. You are right, Chuck does get up for big fights so maybe he will be serious. I am a huge Chuck mark, sorry.
i agree completely
while it is interesting to watch as a fan since theyre both big names, i dont think it would be very competitive.
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Nov 17, 2008 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
Well
for me, it’s because the fight is meaningless. As I wrote above, there is no winner, no matter who “wins”.
Add to that I already don’t like the title holder of one division fighting in another. Whether Penn or Silva, if a fighter holds a title they should either stay where they are, or forfeit the title to go to another division.
Yep. Say what you want about the Spider making the middleweight division look bad but Okami deserves his shot at the belt and by the time that fight happens another contender should emerge (Id love to see Maia-Marquardt)
I think it’s time to turn the page on Liddell and focus on Anderson. That’s what this fight would be. Anderson moving up to 205 and beginning a new run of dominance by taking out the former king of the division.
I hope this is true, and furthermore, I hope he stays at 205. There is nothing left for Anderson Silva at 185.
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