Yushin Okami on the Undercard of UFC 92?!
by Nick Thomas on Oct 31, 2008 4:28 PM EDT
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PrintThe UFC announced the full card for UFC 92: The Ultimate 2008 in Las Vegas on December 27th. The word "stacked" gets thrown around a lot, but... damn. The undercard here could be a UFN all on its own. My only gripe is that Okami vs. Lister won't be televised, though I'm sure they'll be trying to get it on the PPV time permitting, to get Okami some more exposure before a possible title match with Anderson Silva. (Edit: Apparently a bunch of other people are really unhappy about this.)
-- Chris Nelson
Televised Card
Light Heavyweight Championship Bout
Forrest Griffin (champion) vs. Rashad Evans (challenger)
Interim Heavyweight Championship Bout
Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira (champion) vs. Frank Mir (challenger)
Quinton "Rampage" Jackson vs. Wanderlei Silva
Cheick Kongo vs. Mustpha Al-Turk
CB Dollaway vs. Mike Massenzio
Undercard
Yushin Okami vs. Dean Lister
Antoni Hardonk vs. Mark Burch
Matt Hamill vs. Reese Andy
Ryo Chonan vs. Brad Blackburn
Dan Evensen vs. Pat Barry
The Okami/Lister situation is very troublesome. It should be featured as the fourth fight on the main card or, at worst, interchangeable with the Kongo/Al-Turk bout. Shameful..
by Blackout612
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Okami should dye his hair green, get a huge tribal tattoo, question Lister’s manhood during the pre-fight reel, and then come out with his head down throwing hockey punches. A star is born!
And yet it has actual implications within the division, whereas Dollaway vs. Massenszio doesn’t mean anything.
by Chris Nelson on Oct 31, 2008 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah. . . but it’ll still be boring.
Come on, its the end of year card, filled with huge matchups. Lets not foul it up with Okami’s three-round circling and wrestling game.
by Michaelthebox on Oct 31, 2008 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions
I dunno. I thought his fight against Franklin was dull, and supposedly his fight against MacDonald was boring as hell.
He might do enough to entertain the hardcores who follow the title picture, but he’s still way short of keeping the casuals interested.
by Michaelthebox on Oct 31, 2008 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Franklin was just as guilty of making that fight slow and Okami really pushed the third round. MacDonald can be controled and borring is the smartest way to beat him. Okami finished Tanner and I think he can finish Lister.
He's a finisher
..but he’s smart. Seems like the same mentality as the people that are ripping Silva for not letting his hands fly, as though he’s obligated to put on some wild striking exposition, for which people throw money at him.
Lister’s never been finished before, and I’ll be openly shocked if Okami does it.
I don’t get this meme of “he’s good, and people should recognize it, therefore he belongs on the main card!”
Hell, it doesn’t matter what we think. The reality is that the perception of him being boring exists, and it comes from somewhere. It doesn’t matter how effective he is, if a majority of mma fans agree he’s dull and don’t want to watch him fight.
by Michaelthebox on Oct 31, 2008 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I like Okami a lot and I think he would have beat Franklin easily if he had fought the whole match like he did in the third. That being said, I agree with M.T. Box. People always get really bent of of shape when the perceive a fighter’s getting shafted by being put on the undercard. The fight is still going to happen and still has implications, whether we see it or not on PPV.
The fact is, is that CB is fresh off TUF and is a good, young prospect for the UFC and they are obviously trying to promote him. If Okami’s fight ends up being good, I would think you’ll be able to see it free the next day on UFC.com.
There’s ALWAYS fights I want to SEE that are on the undercard, but unfortunately, that’s life. If I had my choice, I’d throw the Mustapha/Kongo fight to the abyss in favor of the Okami fight. But I don’t get to make those decision. They make these decision because sometimes they want to promote, sometimes keep “boring” fighters away, sometimes to punish. Whatever the case may be, why the hell is everyone so occupied talking about this one fight on the undercard and not the three main event caliber matches? I don’t get it.
I would like to see Kongo/Al Turk more. but CB’s match is a throw away TUF loser match. Sure CB could be great, but he is not there yet.
I guess I'm a sucker for a Peruvian Necktie
It’s not a throwaway TUF match, they are trying to promote prospects. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Okami will have not fought in 9 months and I would wager the casual viewer has no clue who he is. CB is a TUF guy and fought on a huge fight night. From a promotion point of vue, I can see why they are doing it.
As far as Kongo, meh. Other than pioneering the template in which to beat Cro Cop, what has he done? I’ve found him thoroughly disappointing and him acting like a goof after knocking out the viking his last fight did nothing to improve my opinion of him. Mustapha though, looking forward to seeing him in action.
From a promotional point of view?
Dude.. With a win, Okami is undoubtedly facing Silva on a main event. You say he’s a virtual unknown. What does that say about promotion? CB won’t be fighting at the top of a card for a long time, if he gets that far. Why do you think Werdum/Santos was on the air rather than the Franca/Aurelio grudge match? Title implications. Promotionally, that’s far more important than a blue chipper from TUF.
Dude.. With a win, Okami is undoubtedly facing Silva on a main event. You say he’s a virtual unknown. What does that say about promotion? CB won’t be fighting at the top of a card for a long time, if he gets that far. Why do you think Werdum/Santos was on the air rather than the Franca/Aurelio grudge match? Title implications. Promotionally, that’s far more important than a blue chipper from TUF.And I’m interested in the Kongo/Al-Turk fight, because they’re both interesting in the HW picture. Not many people know who Al-Turk is yet, but they will.
What is with this thing??
I’ve been getting fucked on posts for two days. It’s repasting my comments..
Say what you will, but it’s been a while since Okami has fought. The UFC makes these kinds of decisions all the time. Why is Okami guaranteed a title fight after this? Fitch won 8 UFC fights in a row before getting a shot. How the hell do you even know Silva will be fighting at 185 any time soon? If he is going to retire, maybe we’ll only be seeing big fights involving Silva. I don’t perceive the UFC thinking Silva/Okami as a big money fight. The fact that Okami is on the undercard should further the point that we likely won’t be seeing Silva at 185 again soon, given the fact that Okami IS the next logical Silva challenger.
And who gives a fuck if CB won’t be at the top of a card for a long time? That doesn’t mean they need to stick him at the bottom, despite the fact you dislike him. They obviously want to promote him. They do this ALL THE TIME.
You posed a question and answered it yourself
given the fact that Okami IS the next logical Silva challenger
Ok? No one is sick over this decision, so take a lap. I’m simply saying that’s the fight I’d rather see— and if you want to argue promotion, CB isn’t selling any PPV’s dude. You have to look forward to a potential main event, and with Silva coming off a fight with a perceived to be over-matched Cote, you think Dana wants people to look at Okami as a subsequent nobody? Come on.. Your promotional angle is a complete dead end. That’s what I’m arguing..
Okami probably wont get to face Silva in a main event. People have been claiming his shot is coming forever now and it never has. He will never sell shit, if they do that fight it will be all about Silva.
by Michael Rome on Oct 31, 2008 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes, the next logical, but UFC doesn’t always make logical decision, do they? They make a lot of decisions based on what they think is best for the promotion. I have to disagree about Okami selling PPV’s though. People wanting to see Silva destroy someone is what sells PPV’s. The projected PPV buys for the last UFC was over 600k. You really think that many people bought into it because they think Cote provided an intriguing matchup?
Ya, I’m at a real dead in too. Thanks for letting me know that. If they didn’t want to promote CB, then why is he on the main card? Shits and giggles?
I really don’t think Okami is getting a shot after what should likely be a win against Lister. My guess is that you’ll see him on as a co-main event or something next if he wins, THEN a shot at the MW title. I really don’t see any other explanation as for him being on the undercard.
And personally, I would like to see Congo on the undercard and Okami promoted. We’re allowed to disagree and have different opinions. It’s okay, it’s allowed. As for taking a lap, I ‘ll have to pass. I’m too busy eating candy, but thanks for the swell advice.
I’m not saying that Okami sells PPV’s. I’m saying they need him to have some mainstream credibility for the sake of marketing his fight with Silva (should it happen).
See, I knew you were eating candy. I’m being health conscious.
Haha, health be damned tonight. Those single packs of reese peanut butter cups are too deadly and addictive.
I agree with you about Okami needing main stream cred before he gets put into a main event. But I really do think the injury hurt him as far as getting tabbed for a title shot again any time soon. Like I said, I assume we’ll be seeing him again high up on a televised/PPV card before getting a title shot.
I beg to differ
I expect Okami to beat the crap out of Lister standing then finish him off with ground and pound.
Okami is relentless if slow paced but he does fight to finish.
Mentioned it in the card..
..but the Okami fight should be featured fourth, no lower than fifth (below Al-Turk/Kongo, maybe). I enjoy the matchup of Dolloway/Massenzio, but that should be the fight vying to make it on TV with a quality showing. Totally shameful.
Especially
considering that CB was proven to be not only over-rated, but a liar as well.
(for those who remember him clearly tapping out, then yelling at the referee for stopping the fight claiming he didn’t, until later admitting that he did).
CB has a ways to go
But I think he’s got tons of potential and could be a serious contender sometime in the future (Massenzio is actually an intriguing prospect, while I’m at it). As for the tap, who knows? Maybe it was an involuntary reaction, but it doesn’t matter; fight was over, not like it’d be overturned..
I’m not making an issue of the tap. It was clear he did, and he admitted he did. It was the immediate reaction when the ref stopped the fight. He stood up all angry like, yelling at the ref for stopping it. Then realizing the stupidity of doing that, since he clearly DID tap, he acknowledged it.
As for him being a contender, I agree. He could be one day. But I’d rather see the deserving 6-1 Okami on the TV card rather than the undeserving 1-1 Dollaway.*
*win/loss in he UFC.
Oh, for sure
I’m not saying it receives precedent, I’m merely saying it’s still an interesting fight. Speaks to the strength of the card. But of course it should not be aired over the Okami/Lister fight. I’m a big Okami fight, not arguing that..
Wonder what this means for Okami’s title shot? If the UFC was seriously wanting him to sell a PPV with Anderson Silva in the future you would think they would be pushing him more.
I get the impression that he has to “prove it”. Then, he’ll make air and get the title shot, all in one. I don’t feel that he should have to go to those lengths. He was far more deserving of a title shot than Cote was (who I previously had losing to Almeida on the worst judged MMA card I’ve ever seen).
Can’t get too worked up, this fight is sure to be boring as shit.
by Michael Rome on Oct 31, 2008 5:19 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I like Okami a lot
6-1 in the UFC with the one loss being to Rich Franklin in a fight where he had Franklin in deep trouble and almost sub’d him in the third round. Hope he beats Lister in a fun fight and then gets a shot at the Spider next.
Amen. Okami is should be featured.
My problem is with the matchup. Okami shouldn’t be fighting Dean Lister. He’s a contender and should only get other contenders until he’s awarded a title shot. A fight with Hendo or Marquardt would be interesting. Even Bisping or Leites or Maia. Not sure why Dana is giving him the Karo treatment, unless Okami has turned down higher profile fights.
by Jaydoggydog on Oct 31, 2008 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Simply put
Nobody in the UFC has any meaningful wins at 185 except Anderson against Hendo. The closest is Marquardt beating Misaki before he became any good. There is a reason MMAWeekly’s rankings now reflect mine at 185 when people always said my rankings were trolls. UFC’s 185 class sucks. Its the most spread out talentwise of any of divisions. Lawler, Trigg, Mousasi, Manhoef, Jacare, Filho, Akiyama, Lindland, Misaki, hell even Kang who has been in a slump is a better win than any of the UFC 185ers have…
(I was just looking at the September Meta-rankings at MW and Leben is 1 slot below Manhoef – this makes me laugh.)
Okami, Henderson, Marquardt, Franklin, Leites, Cote, Bisping, Maia, Kampmann, Leben and McDonald. What a bunch of garbage those guys are. What a TERRIBLE dvision. Hey I can rattle off names to try and prove a point too! You even put Filho in your list, who’s likely on his way to the UFC soon. Nevermine Manhoef, who’s claimed he’s retiring.
The only reason the UFC division looks bad, is because Silva has been making them look bad. Who exactly did you name that you think could actually beat Silva?
I'd take action on Manhoef
As he’s even more devastating on his feet and Anderson’s wrestling is lacking. I’d take action on Lindland to submit him or grind out a decision and I’d take action on Jacare to submit him as well.
Totally ridiculous
Have you seen Manhoef, Lindland and Jacare’s last fights? Manhoef is retiring from MMA, Jacare is totally overrated and Lindland is old. Hater..
So point being
Okami not having any meaningful wins doesn’t matter. He is by far the most worthy competitor to Anderson in the UFC he hasn’t fought yet. After Okami its Maia then Leitas.
I agree that Okami is top contender, but he does have meaningful wins. I also agree that the MW talent is more spread out then the other divisions, but I think UFC is still the leader. Its just that the UFC MWs have little exposure to the MWs that are not in the UFC. There are few places they intersect so it makes it hard to compair
Totally Fair
Okami doesnt deserve a shot unless he finishes. This way the fight will only air if its quick enough to fit in to the time left over. He has to finish as quick as he can.
I think we will see this one moved to the main card anyway. The thing is, from what I understand Silva/Liddell is increasingly likely for February, and then after that he’d probably face another big name. Maybe Robbie Lawler? Anyway, I don’t see Okami getting a shot anytime soon. He missed his best chance in October, and if the people around him knew what was good for him they’d agree to fight Silva in NOvember in exchange for some good money.
We all know why the fight is on the undercard. While he is one of the most decorated grapplers in the game, Lister is not a well rounded MMA fighter, and his style is boring. Okami’s methodical GnP is also less than crowd pleasing. Also, this fight can only hurt Okami. If he loses, is Lister then considered a contender? If Okami wins, does he get Silva immediately, or will Silva fight at LHW again? And does Okami stand a chance anyway?
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chances are another fight will run short. Then it could be a swing bout. At least his way we are protected in the event that Lister/Okami ends up a snoozefest.
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