Anderson Silva's "Temper Tantrum"
by Michael Rome on Oct 27, 2008 3:40 PM EDT
in MMA News
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Over at Yahoo, Maggie Hendricks blasts Anderson Silva for having a temper tantrum, all while having her own in the form of a hectoring article:
He is a professional fighter, and needs to do the job. Period. He is paid to fight the person put in front of him. This is not any different from you or me. Can you imagine what would happen if you showed up at work today and decided to not do your job? You might not like the work that you have to do that day, but you still have to do it. It is no different for Silva. I agree that the UFC needs to find better opponents for Silva, but the way for him to cajole his bosses into searching for better fighters is not to throw a childlike tantrum. He needs to destroy his opponents convincingly, and then ask for what he wants like a man.
Listen, I was critical of Silva's performance, but this condescending tone is way over the line. It was a 5 round fight, Silva is completely entitled to take his time. I'd rather see him demolish dudes, but it is nowhere in his job description that he absolutely has to murder guys in the first round. I would have rather seen him do that than play games and toy with Cote, but it's well within his right to do so for a couple rounds.
According to Fight Metric (and anyone who watched the fight), Silva completely dominated. He took his time with the fight, and would have probably finished in the third round if not for Cote's injury. I think a lot of the disappointment on the internet comes from the fact that we felt entitled to see Silva destroy Cote, and now that we didn't get it, it's like Christmas morning without presents. Maybe we should all grow up...
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Also, and I’m not saying this is for sure, but isn’t it possible that Anderson Silva has attained a level of fight mastery that allowed him to shatter Cote’s tendons with his mind?
This is something I have been considering.
by Michael Rome on Oct 27, 2008 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Ditto.
I admit I criticized Silva after the fight but now that it’s been a couple of days, I admit that I should have given Silva the benefit of the doubt. It was only one fight, and yeah, I guess I’ve come to expecting Silva to destroy his apponents rather than toy with them. That being said, Maggie Hendricks is way over the top here. I don’t think Silva was throwing a “temper tantrum.”
Yeah, What Temper Tantrum?
When did I miss Silva’s temper tantrum? He seemed pretty bummed out that Cote hurt his knee but I have yet to hear him throw a tantrum. This Maggie Hendricks person is getting way too much attention for some really ignorant comments. Why are we paying attention to her?
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
Oh I see
Hendricks is interpreting Silva’s fight performance as a “Temper Tantrum”. She is ridiculas and the fans in Chicago sucked.
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
[size8][color=springgreen]does this work[/color][/size]
"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"
One time and people want to CRUCIFY Silva at the cross???????
This guy and REPEATEDLY, time after time destroyed all his opponents in CONVINCING fashion. SO he didnt want a Liddel repeat, or he was bored, or WHATEVER was the reason was……this is the FIRST time in 8 UFC fights where he didnt convincingly break his opponent.
Come on. There are many, many other fighters in the UFC that need this kind of criticism. Many other fighter REPEATEDLY decision their opponents. Silva is not one of them. Maybe if he went out and did this one or two more times….then people may want to voice such displeasure
If it had went 41/2 rounds of the same and then Silva had highlight reel KO’d him people wouldn’t be talking about how horrible it was still. Fans expected a horrible beating for Cote and because they didn’t get that they are throwing Silva under the bus. When has Silva ever been disrespectful to another fighter(or anything for that matter)? When has Silva ever intentionally stalled a fight? So now all the sudden he’s Josh Koscheck after one performance? It was a bad performance and he knows it, perhaps it’s time people give up on the internet psychoanalysis and assuming they know what Anderson Silva was actually thinking during the fight.
Eventually...no matter if it were 3 ,4 , or 5 rounds.......
Silva would of got the KO…..and most likely a highlight reel KO. That is my thinking on the subject
I think the vast majority of people complaining about Silva’s performance have no idea what it’s like to actually fight, much less fight against the level of competition you see in the UFC. Cote has serious KO power and it’s up to Silva to respond as he sees fit. If that means waiting for opportunities to counter, playing psychological games to get into Cote’s head, or utilizing foot movement, so be it. He had 5 rounds to implement his game plan. I respect Dana White, but if he wants to see a 30 second KO, then he should make championship fights 1 round, not 5.
The people criticizing Silva for not knocking Cote out within 1 round are the same people who think a BJJ black belt sucks for not submitting an opponent as soon as they hit the ground. Which means they don’t really get MMA at the highest level in the least.
Cry me a river dude. Silva is paid to fight and he decided to display his new bloated ego rather than his fighting skills. He has attacked much better strikers with more aggressiveness. I don’t criticize silva for not finishing Cote. I blame him for only throwing 2 combos a round and filling the rest of the time with pacing and hand waving. I don’t believe you have a 5 round fight so you can dick away most the time in the name of “throwing your opponent off”, I believe you have 5 rounds so the fight will go as long as it has to. “Elusiveness” is becoming the equivilent to Dean Smith’s 4 corner offense in basketball. Before the shot clock Dean Smith got the brilliant idea that if his team got up by 2 points, they could just pass the ball around until the time clock wore off and win Sure, he won a ton of games but he also almost ruined the sport, he is the reason basketball has a shot clock now. Even though he had an effective and original strategy it was unsportsmanlike because it took away most of the actual playing of the game. I don’t like the fighting style Silva displayed Saturday and I don’t like a lot of what Machida does, not because I don’t appreciate skill, but because I believe it goes against the spirit of sport fighting.
I see your point, but it all depends on what you define as the “spirit of sport fighting”. Regarding Machida, I don’t think he is taking advantage of the RULES to win fights in the same way that Dean Smith took advantage of the lack of shot clock to deprive the opposing team of offensive opportunities. Machida’s STYLE is problematic for opponents in that they can’t figure out a way to get in close without taking lots of damage. That is what sport fighting is all about, one style versus another. He is not taking advantage of the rules. Do you support the trend of refs in the US standing up fighters soon after they hit the ground (like in the Nelson vs. Arlovski fight)? Because if anything, the ebb and flow of the ground game is closer to your Dean Smith parallel than anything Silva or Machida have shown.
I believe Machida and others who are trying to emulate ARE taking advantage of the rules. There is a rule that you are not allowed to be timid and Machida and others borderline a timidity foul. Personally, I enjoy watching two great grapplers fight on the ground more than two strikers on their feet. And I would definately rather watch 2 mediocre grapplers struggle to fight each other on the ground than watch Machida run most the fight and then pretend he fought bravely. Machida has finished 1 fight since 2004… Machida’s style is to win decisions by landing a few punches and running the rest of the time. He is the Dean Smith of MMA.
Dude...
If you don’t like what Machida does then you would seem to only like strikers that go balls out trying to finish the fight at every second. That is unreasonable to me.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Oct 27, 2008 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I greatly enjoyed the Sherk vs Griffon fight. I wouldn’t classify that as a balls out brawl. But they were both attacking and counterattcking and were mostly slipping punches rather than running. I wish Machida could fight Machida so we could watch 2 fighters err counterpunchers stare at each other waiting for the other to dare pretend that this is a fight and make a move. If you don’t move in on a counterpuncher the fight turns into a staring contest because they sure as hell aren’t ever coming forward. That is why counterpunchers are against the spirit of the sport, because if you put two of them together you don’t have a fight.
If either Sherk or Griffin
had the power of Silva or Cote that fight would have never went down the way it did. Guys who are not skilled strikers & that do not posess that KO power can stand there & trade freely with little worry of getting KTFO. Just like strikers trying to keep away from the ground against a top level BJJ guy.
"Counterpunchers are against the spirit of the sport"
If you don’t move in on a counterpuncher the fight turns into a staring contest because they sure as hell aren’t ever coming forward. That is why counterpunchers are against the spirit of the sport, because if you put two of them together you don’t have a fight.
You’re assuming a counterpuncher will never change his strategy. This is like saying putting two BJJ black belts in the cage will result in a draw. But set aside for a moment the fact that being a counterpuncher IS a wholly legitimate path for a fighter and remember that this is MIXED MARTIAL ARTS. A fighter doesn’t have to stand in front of a counterpuncher if he doesn’t want to do so. He can shoot in, take him to the ground, and work for submissions or ground-and-pound. If someone like Cote cannot successfully shoot in on Silva, then that’s a weakness he’s going to have to deal with. Don’t blame it on Silva.
Claiming that “counterpunchers are against the spirit of the sport” isn’t an informed statement as much as it is someone stating their preference for all-out brawls on the feet. Which is totally fine and a legit preference, but don’t impugn the sport as a whole, you know?
Okay how about this, name me one fight where a fighter came in with a counter punching strategy and then abandoned it when the other fighter stopped moving forward. All you have to do to neutralize a counterpuncher is to stop coming forward…. Ill say that again… THE MOST EFFECTIVE WAY TO NEUTRALIZE A COUNTERPUNCHER IS TO NOT FIGHT AT ALL. If you want to use the logic that counterpunchers are afraid to get hit so that is why they run, then fine. I won’t move in on a counterpuncher because I don’t want to get hit, end of fight.
They could take the center of the Octagon and then wait.
by Richard Wade on Oct 27, 2008 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
… says the guy who doesn’t know the difference between “your” and “you’re” and thinks counterpunchers are “against the spirit” of mma.
Oh snap, bringing out the grammar are we. Why don’t you explain you points logically rather than using logical fallacies to try to discredit my points. I have written like 10 paragraphs now and you point out I misspelled your, obviously you win.
So anything of substance you want to contribute?
I wasn’t addressing your “points.” I was addressing the beauty of you calling someone an idiot while not understanding a very basic spelling rule that most fourth graders do know.
If I wanted to address your points, I guess I’d ask you where this “spirit of mma” law that you are invoking comes from. Are wrestlers against the spirit of mma because they like to take people down instead of boxing them? Are bjj guys against the spirit of mma because they like to work for submissions instead of punching or kicking? Is Houston Alexander more in tune with the spirit of mma because he comes forward all aggressive-like, consequences and the importance of knowing how to do more than punch be damned?
Anderson Silva has submitted some of the best submissions guys in his weight class — Lutter, for example. He has knocked out pure strikers — Leben and Irvin. He has outmuscled strength guys — Franklin. Anderson Silva basically does whatever is necessary to win, and has shown an ability to do so with about every facet of mma imaginable. To say he is “against the spirt of mma” is one of the silliest things I’ve ever read.
In this particular fight, your counterstriker landed nearly twice as many shots as your aggressive mma guy — and the power shots were even more lopsided. He basically was the only one to secure any kind of top control in the entire fight, on the ground. Maybe you missed it when he came forward and kicked Cote in the face, or when he came forward and kneed Cote in the face? Those things shouldn’t have happened if all Cote had to do was stand real still and quiet.
I think you are basically just an Anderson Silva hater who is resorting to hyperbole and, now, name-calling when you can’t seem to get people to agree with you.
I could be wrong, though. It wouldn’t be the first time, and I can admit that. How about you?
by Kierkegaard on Oct 27, 2008 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
First, it was a typo. I have been typing fast with minimal proofreading, plus firefox doesn’t pick up on mistakes like that. Take a logic class and you will see your error in trying to discredit me because I made a simple typo.
As for my "spirit of mma’ law, read the whole conversation and you will understand more. It started from a Dean Smith analogy I used. I am surprised a fine scholar such as you didn’t catch up before posting.
Your third paragraph is completely irrelevant to anything I said or to anything this conversation has been about.
It was obvious Silva was landing very clean shots when he actually threw something, so what was he waiting for. You just spent two paragraphs telling me how good Silva is at hurting people, so why did he need to be so weird and passive for most of the fight? If he attacked with even an average frequency Cote never would have lasted 2 rounds.
"I think you are basically just an Anderson Silva hater who is resorting to hyperbole and, now, name-calling when you can’t seem to get people to agree with you.
I could be wrong, though. It wouldn’t be the first time, and I can admit that. How about you?"
Self righteous much? You resorted to insults with your first post so aren’t you just being a hypocrite?
Yeah, I think of all the time I’ve wasted coming up with arguments to somebody’s point when I could have just done something elegant like that… wow – the wasted time I’ll never get back.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Why haven’t we ever gotten to read these brilliant arguments you’ve apparently spent so much time coming up with?
;-)
by Richard Wade on Oct 27, 2008 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, they’re here – BE installed an idiot filter that keeps smartasses from reading them…. oh, I wasn’t supposed to mention that…
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
The athletic commissions have a rule where it is a foul to refuse to engage but that has nothing to do with anything that Machida does or the Anderson SIlva fight it’s about fighter who refuse to engage at all for any reason. It’s a rule that basically says you can’t go into a fight and completly refuse to fight. Kalib Starnes was pushing it in his fight with Quarry but Machida has never even been close to a foul, heck Machida is normally outstriking his opponents in exchanges. People like to wheel that rule out all the time without actually understanding what it means.
When a fighter has a style that frustrates his opponents and stifles their game, the onus is on those opponents to solve that problem, NOT the UFC in the form of rule changes. Just because no one has solved Machida yet doesn’t mean he can’t be knocked out or submitted. When Sean Sherk was dominating the lightweight division with his wrestling and grinding out boring decisions, nobody suggested the UFC alter its rules to put wrestlers at a disadvantage. The onus was on BJ Penn to figure out a way to defeat him and he did, masterfully, using his reach, a stiff jab, and the threat of his superior BJJ skills to negate Sherk’s comfort zones.
If a fighter like Machida (or Silva, for that matter) chooses a strategy that is based on counter-striking and evasion, that is fully their right and if the fight is boring they will pay for it in indirect ways: not winning any KO or Fight of the Night bonuses, having opponents turn down fights, and having UFC management decline to put them in a position to headline PPVs due to fan disinterest.
And I have to think the timidity rule that mentions “avoiding contact with an opponent” does not mean slipping punches, circling out, and changing stances before unleashing combos. Any reasonable person would say that this rule doesn’t apply to Silva and Machida.
“When Sean Sherk was dominating the lightweight division with his wrestling and grinding out boring decisions, nobody suggested the UFC alter its rules to put wrestlers at a disadvantage.”
IIRC there were people suggesting that.
by Richard Wade on Oct 27, 2008 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Next thing you know we’ll be suggesting rules changes to put steroid users at a disadvantage.
Oh, wait …
I may have missed people suggesting the UFC alter its rules to stop wrestlers from imposing their style.
Personally, I don’t like watching wrestling-based fighters like Sherk or Koscheck as much as I like watching skilled strikers or BJJ players. In particular, I think the increasingly popular strategy of shooting in for a meaningless take down with 20 seconds left in the round just to “score points” with the judges is a total joke and an attempt to manipulate the judges’ criteria. But I really balk at changing MMA’s rules for the sole purpose of neutralizing one style of fighting’s advantage, even if it means slower fights with one guy lying on another like a blanket that ends in a decision.
It’s a slippery slope. Where would you stop?
But on the other hand, look at the evolution of GSP: he’s become a wrestler who either wins by ground-n-pound or uses it to get a submission. And I know that none of us have a problem with that.
It’s the Sherk-style lay-n-pray/tiny little fist jabs to the forehead guys that kill me.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
I think Sherk’s issues have more to do with physical limitations than anything.
by Richard Wade on Oct 27, 2008 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Then I hate him for being himself. Suck on it, Mr. Rogers!
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
29. Timidity, including, without limitation, avoiding contact with an opponent, intentionally or consistently dropping the mouthpiece or faking an injury.
For some reason some people equate not letting the other guy punch you in the face as avoiding contact. The guys who get labeled as “elusive” aren’t avoiding contact they are chosing to have contact on their terms which is actually a pretty smart strategy. If Machida was violating the “timidity” rule then he wouldn’t be winning his fights. As for Anderson Silva’s fight how can you be dominating the entire fight and being illegally timid at the same time? That really doesn’t make sense.
????
That was supposed to answer my question as to how you can be dominating a fight and be illegally timid or just answering what you prefer to see in a fight? The timid rule is about refusing to fight by completly staying away from the other fighter not about picking your shots or dodging the other guy’s punches and kicks. Fightmetric had Cote’s strike accuracy at 17%, he was throwing and missing, when you are close enough that the other guy can try and hit you then you aren’t avoiding combat you are just not allowing the other guy to land shots on you. Avoiding contact is staying so far a way the other guy doesn’t have a chance of contacting you not making him miss when he tries to hit you.
you know.....
im just glad all of this is starting to calm done a bit.
i gotta admit it was really depressing to hear what seemed like the world thrash on our world middleweight champion. but seriously, it was one bad fight.
but this fight WAS going to end in a knockout. and i think that all of this backlash about the dancing and the “disrespect” would not be near as loud if it were not for the sudden cote injury.
Classic Case
of being a victim of his own success. We become so acustom to seeing him destroy opponents in the first round, that the minute he doesn’t everyone freaks out and blames him for it.
new here
Hi guys im new to this site, and id like to say its great!, personally i hate maggie, everything she writes is RIDICULOUS!!!!
It's only one fight.
It is impossible to critique his game plan when the fight ended due to an injury to his opponent, it is inconclusive.
If the gripe is with his ability to stick and move and avoid staying in the pocket with a brawler, I call that a sound strategy, it isn’t his fault that Cote was injured.
Blaming Anderson for his dancing style and how the fight played out is akin to blaming Cote for his knee.
Anderson has had this style for a long time, he used it against Franklin with spectacular results, but Franklin shows his weaknesses visibly when he is under pressure and Anderson capitalizes on them.
Cote’s gameplan did throw him off a bit, and he did not run into any punches that hurt him, so Anderson just kept sticking and moving until he could find a way to capitalize on an error that Cote made.
Look at all of his fights, he rarely presses the attack against a fresh opponent, and sticks and moves until they get hurt and then goes in for the kill. Cote never looked hurt, he never went for the kill, people get upset, it’s only one fight, don’t read into it too much.
exactly!
To me, the only sad thing about this fight was Côté’s knee injury, otherwise I thought it was an exciting fight (yeah, really!). People say that Silva let Silva go to the third round, but I don’t believe this.
Seriously, Côté is a brawler with a solid chin (and he proved it by absorbing some solid shots). Should Silva simply ignore this because he’s the Oh So Great Best P4P Anderson Silva? no.
And was Côté supposed to just go in there and fight “Leben style”? He was more careful than the previous fighters who were destroyed by Silva. He had a game plan, and win or lose it easily took him to the third round.
If a fight needs to go to distance for either fighter to win, then so be it. The two fighters both had a plan for this fight. The only thing they couldn’t predict was the knee injury.
Roy would take Anderson...
and embarrass him. Can we get over the RJJ talk?
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Oct 27, 2008 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I'll give up the RJJ talk if.....
….If you swear that you wouldn’t watch that fight. Or at least be interested.
I’ve been reading what everyone has to say about Silva’s performance and it seems silly to think that he was just playing around with Cote. He’s always been extremely professional and has always spoken of the UFC in a positive light and to think that he was sticking it to the for poor match making seems way out of character and ridiculous.
It did seem like he was trying to keep Cote out of his game, while giving him a fair bit of respect by trying to take Cote’s opportunity of landing a big shot away. Every time he engaged Cote, he landed big shots, it just wasn’t very often.
The other possibility is the one that he was having an off night or that he couldn’t find his rhythm. I re-watched it today and his corner men seem positively angry with him after the first round. I don’t know what was going on or if they were trying to fire him up, but it’s nothing I’ve seen with him before.
Who knows what the reasons are, but I think it can be confidently said that he wasn’t being unprofessional or disrespectful.
I think you might be correct.
First round was unusual by Silva standards, I admit, but the second? I felt like he had Cote in minor trouble early, then it went to clinch at the cage for a while, some leg kicks and the TD. Offering him his hand was strange also, though, could be all in good fun, could also be some weird form of disrespect. I don’t know. This was followed by a period of baiting Cote until the round ended with some nice knees to the body. Honestly, 2nd round wasn’t half bad.
by ununkvadrium on Oct 27, 2008 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions
The Spider raised the bar so high with his previous performances that a significant number of people were upset about his performance Saturday. It was one lackluster outing amongst a body of work within the UFC that is absolutely remarkable. People that are still losing their minds over this need to chill out and stop whining. Put this in perspective. There’s a lot of other shit to get up in arms about if that’s your desire.
Surprised by criticism
I was unable to watch the fight on Saturday night-so I read/heard all the criticism prior to watching and was expecting the worst. What I saw was an exceptional fighter both entertaining and dismantling (albeit slowly) his opponent. When Silva did engage his combinations were as lethal as ever. If Cote had not been injured and Silva had knocked him out in the 4th would people still be outraged?
My problem with Anderson, wasn’t that he didn’t demolish Cote and finish in the first round. It was the dancing, spinning the hands, offering a hand to get him up and so on… I just expect more professionalism from him, due to the standards he has set.
Cote is delirious if he thinks he gave Silva ANY kind of a problem Saturday. The End.
As for Maggie, this article IS a perfect example of her not doing her job satisfactorily. The naive view that Anderson should demolish his opponent is ridiculous and completely insults any fighter who enters the cage with him. And funny she would use such a sexist statement as “ask for what he wants like a MAN”, lol.
I didn’t like Anderson’s performance Saturday night, but her assessment of the fight is way off base.
http://eliotmarshall.com/
My problem with Anderson, wasn’t that he didn’t demolish Cote and finish in the first round. It was the dancing, spinning the hands, offering a hand to get him up and so on… I just expect more professionalism from him, due to the standards he has set.
100000% agree. This whole “issue” has so many apples, oranges and 180s that it makes the mind boggle.
So were you upset about Cote’s constantly switching stances? Because that looked as much like dancing as anything Silva did. All the stuff you mentioned is what your perception of it was but that doesn’t necessarily mean that is what was actually intended. Heck the offering a hand to get up wasn’t something that surprised me out of Silva or something that I thought of as disrepect or unprofessional and the crazy wu shu hands made me think he was trying to get Cote to do something (anything). It’s not like Silvia was out there doing the running man, it’s just a matter of how the viewer percieved his actions.
I’m basing it off his past performances. He was toying with Cote, end of story. Like I said, not a big deal, I just expect more form AS.
http://eliotmarshall.com/
Toying with him and respecting his striking ability are completly different things that could look very similar during a fight. Saying you didn’t like how he fought is completly understandable but we don’t know what he was thinking or what he was trying to do.
Cote was missing by a foot on most of his punches. Cote has a questionable ground game, yet AS didn’t want to finish him on the ground for some reason. It spells trying to be a crowd pleaser, imo. Irvin is arguably a more dangerous striker, but AS moved quickly and finished.
I hope you are right and this was about respecting Cote, but it just doesn’t feel that way. A lot has been made of him not being a big draw and not selling PPVs, so i think this might have come into play. I think he just had an opportunity to face a “lesser” opponent and put on a big show, but he missed the mark.
http://eliotmarshall.com/
Don’t you think AS works much better from the guard than he does on top? Seems to me that he’s trained his BJJ around the idea of being taken by wrestlers down more than anything.
From that perspective, standing up was the right move.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
I can't recall Anderson Silva
doing much from top position in any fight or passing anyone’s guard. Can someone name a fight where he did either?
dnevil001 is right about Henderson round 2, I think – Hendo pulled guard and Silva took the back, right?
(And of course I just deleted this off my TiVo two days ago….)
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
From Sherdog’s play by play:
Henderson dropped to his knees in search of a takedown, which Silva stuffed and took the top in half-guard. With a minute left in the round, Henderson gave up his back, where Silva punched away with a body-triangle. Silva sunk in a rear-naked choke which forced Henderson to tap. Silva retains the middleweight crown at 4:52 of the second.
So, to answer your question: kinda.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Wasn’t he toying with Rich Franklin when he dropped his hands and just dodged his strikes by leaning back and forth? This kind of clowning – which I would put in the same category as shit-talking in basketball – is exactly what I expect from him.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Absolutely, but it was very limited. Saturday night seemed like a marathon, lol.
http://eliotmarshall.com/
So the problem isn’t clowing, it’s the percentage? What’s the maximum allowable? :-)
And not to rain on the pity party (not directed at you), but all this bitching that Silva didn’t deliver the performance that people wanted from him is a bit silly, right? I mean, his past performances are an embarrassment of riches, if anything. By comparison, Fedor has gone to a decision in 24% of his wins. Silva? 21%, and not since 2004.
People need to STFU, am I right?
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
I know you are joking, but there absolutely is an amount that crosses the line. Not sure what it is but you get my point.
I do agree this has gotten out of hand, but probably because it was so unexpected and out of character for Silva.
http://eliotmarshall.com/
Of course as fans
we would love to see them both go in the middle, bang the crap out of each other & never back down, but that is not exactly the best strategy in a fight when both guys put people down for their specialty
That isn’t what I want at all.
But compare Machida’s elusiveness to Silva’s movements Saturday night. While machida strikes then moves, Silva is running around, spinning his hands and offering to help up an opponent. IMO, the two aren’t comparable and that wasn’t what we were seeing on Saturday.
Silva had a clear reach advantage and barely had to move at all to avoid Cote. At no time was Silva in danger from Cote. It was purely putting on a show. That is fine, but if i thought that is how Anderson was going to fight every time out, I wouldn’t spend my $55 to see it. Conversely, I would pay anytime to see the normal Silva and I would also happily pay to see Machida fight.
http://eliotmarshall.com/
I can agree with that assessment,
I wish my $55 was rewarded with a more action-packed main event as well. In saying that, I can also respect someones gameplan as long as they do engage at some point.
Wait, fighters aren’t our trained monkeys who must do exactly what we want them to do? They actually get to decide how they want to fight?
I’m so confused…
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Exactly,
I saw a comment from someone previously that there is a “you cannot be timid rule” that I guess was directed at Silva? I guess that everyone is supposed to fight like Alexander/Jardine and simply stand in front of each other & throw bombs.
The timid rule is about fighters that refuse to engage at all for any reason(Kalib Starnes?) it doesn’t apply to the Anderson Silva fight, heck Silva was the one engaging and doing damage in the fight, it’s not like there were no kicks and punches thrown. People like to bring up that rule but it’s obvious they don’t have any comprehension of what it actually means.
I am constantly amazed about how many people who claim to be “true” or “hardcore” fans of the sport don’t really understand the rules. Of course not even the refs agree with what some of the rules means so perhaps I shouldn’t be that surprised.
Agree completely,
someone posted that the ref in the Werdum fight should have stopped it as soon as his ears flopped & he hit the mat, but what if they ref did that in the Alves/Koschek fight? We would have missed out on a very entertaining remainder of that fight. Everyone wants each fight to be Alexander/Jardine or Liddell/Silva
Anderson silva didn’t engage at all for almost 4 minutes of the fight. How is that not being timid? How is that not avoiding contact? Explain that.
I guess we watched different fights, I’ve sat through it three times now and I don’t remember 4 minutes of a five minute round where there was no contact any time during the fight. Silva did go the first minute and a half of the fight before he threw a good leg kick but he wasn’t “avoiding contact” he was avoiding Cote’s shotsbefore that(the few punches/kicks that Cote actually threw). There is no rule in any book that says you have to allow the other guy to hit you, that would be stupid.
Four consecutive minutes? That didn’t happen.
by Richard Wade on Oct 27, 2008 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Everyone seems to have an opinion on what happened, but no one is listening to the only 2 people that were in the fight. Silva never said that he was messing around, he showed obvious agitation at those questions at the press conference. He very firmly said that he was not messing around. And Cote said that he thought that Anderson was “scared to exchange with him”(now that is not exactly true) what he wanted to say that Unlike all others Cote was still there swinging after anderson delivered what would be stunning shots on his opponent. So I do believe that it threw off Silva a bit. I think other opponents would have got stunned and stumble a bit and have Silva finished them like the killer that he is. But I really do believe that he was a bit surprised that after he would land a few really solid shots he had to avoid a solid hook from Cote that would have became the Matt Serra Shot. So he was happy for a bit to take him apart from a distance. and soften him up.
by RiskReturnGroup on Oct 27, 2008 2:58 PM EDT reply actions
Professionally speaking, that was some bullshit. Everybody has an off night, but I’m not going to goof around in a fight. I still respect him, but I’ll be damn if you gonna drop your hands with me boy. I tell you what, you start doing that hippie hippie shake, you better expect something crazy. I’m going to throw something and I don’t give a fuck if you knock me out with me trying. You’re gonna be like, “I can’t believe this motherfucker tried to take my head off.” I told everybody… it happens to every fighter, and I’m not leaving myself out of the equation, you start getting the big head. Personally, he got lucky. You don’t do that. Showboating is fine sometimes and I give Mr. Cote props because he done better than any other fighter I’ve seen fight Anderson, like Chris Leben, Rich Franklin and Travis Lutter. He looked a sgood as he could look.
Shonie Carter in an interview with Fighthype.
Bottom line for me is...
It doesn’t bother me one bit if Anderson wanted to take his sweet time to properly attack Cote. What bothered me and a lot of people was the disrespect he showed to Cote, fighter to fighter. No one has really mentioned the fact that this was the probably the absolute biggest moment of Cote’s career to him and Anderson ruined it by not being a respectful fighter, not by defeating him. Im sure Cote woulda rather lost by TKO in round 1 then get the run-around pants off dance off.
So Silva disrespected him by respecting Cote’s striking ability but bullying him around the cage and beating the crap out of him would of been being being respectful? Did Anderson Silva ever say he was trying to disrespect Patrick Cote? Has Cote made a statement that he felt Silva was disrespecting him during the fight? Are you a psychic mind reader? Perhaps us random fans on the internet should give up on saying what the fighters were thinking during the fight or what their intentions actually were because we just don’t know.
Have you even fought in a cage? I have…Are you friends with any Professional fighters?? I am. If you have never been in or around the cage I don’t expect you to understand. You don’t train for 12 weeks to have some clown dance in front of you. PERIOD!
whoa wait a minute Silva was coming off on the better end of the striking game so you can’t exactly say he spent the whole time dancing in front of him
u r right...
he did strike better i do agree…from what a read he threw 29 stikes (not 100% on that) at 1 second per strike that’s 29 seconds. So 1 minute of striking total maybe from silva, 9 min 30 seconds of dancing…
So because your a “fighter” you know what Cote and Silva were thinking during the fight? Saying “I’m a fighter so I understand what fighters are thinking during a fight” doesn’t pan out because this still isn’t about what you or your friends thought it’s about what Silva’s intentions were during the fight and how Cote perceived Silva’s actions(by his statement it seems that Cote took Silva’s actions to mean that he was getting to him). I am in no way trying to disrespect you as a fighter because I do have a lot of respect for anyone who does but fighters are individuals with different expectations and viewpoints just like everyone else, you can’t say what either was intending or thinking during that fight.
If Silva didn’t intend to disrespect him and Cote didn’t feel like he was being disrespected then that is all that would matter on that subject, our feelings on respect between the two are irrelevant. Until those two guys actually tell us then it’s sort of silly for us to even be speculating on it.
by who me on Oct 27, 2008 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Right on,
from what we know about Silva he does not disrespect anyone. Look at his past fights with Franklin. He & Franklin showed as much or more respect than we have ever seen two fighters show towards one another. I truly believe that Silva was being respectful when offering a hand to Cote. Some people may not feel that way & that is their prerogative.
hold on a second a couple of weeks ago everyone was criticizing Rashad Evans for doing the same thing.
What, you mean luring his opponent into attacking wildly and then knocking him the fuck out? I guess some people were criticizing him for that. I certainly wasn’t. It was smart and effective.
I Reshad did what he did cause that was the only way for him to win. Avoid everything and maybe one of these hay makers will land. Or Silva avoiding the inside fight because that is the only way he was going to loose. The only thing that could be compared is that they both respected the other fighters punching power.
by RiskReturnGroup on Oct 27, 2008 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t call it a haymaker that he was hoping to land Greg Jackson even said in an interview that chuck tended to drop his hand when throwing an uppercut but that’s beside the point. Silva was luring Cote into him and using a longer reach to inflict damage Rashad was luring Chuck into him and setting up his shots both were pretty elusive and obviously came off on the better end of the striking game.
Everyone needs to stop with the "Anderson was bored" theory
Anderson was not bored.
Anderson was having fun.
Anderson deserves to have fun at his profession, and fight HOWEVER THE F*** HE PLEASES
Everyone in here does not fight, and I suspect its those people who are saying he was bored.
I fight once a week, and I can tell you this, even when fighting less skilled opponents, it’s NEVER boring.
Don’t you wish you had a career that you enjoyed and had fun at?
And to Dropkick, you were making good points when you started, but you refuse to concede any valid points that others make, and it’s only going to make people less interested in hearing what you have to say. Trust me, I know what its like thinking you’re right with all your heart and never giving up your position, but when someone proves you wrong, be a man and admit it! We’ll all respect you that much more.
Also, I’m a counter striker, and I’ve noticed that the only people who complain about counter-strikers are those who don’t train or fight (so they don’t understand the nuances of the technique), or those who fight but can’t crack the the code of the counter striker.
So, which are you?
Also, boredom and ego are not the same thing. I fear that Anderson may finally be giving in a bit to the hype built around him, and it just might be his undoing.
"The path to enlightenment is through suffering"
by RearNakedChoker on Oct 27, 2008 6:02 PM EDT reply actions
I do train. I have only been training for about 5 months so I hardly call myself a fighter. I am a lanky 6’6" so people don’t spend a whole lot of time trying to counter punch me in a traditional manner, but I do prefer to fight on the ground. I have decent talent on the ground but I admit I am very novice on my feet. But I would prefer to try to slip a punch and return fire or go for a take down than remove myself from engagement. My favorite fighters are Nick Diaz, Jason MacDonald, and BJ Penn.
I think fighters should be able to impose their will on their opponent rather than only being able to work off your opponent. Ill admit Silva didn’t deserve a timidity foul, I only brought that up because I believe some counter strikers do use passivity and the other fighters fear of boring the crowd to bait their opponent. I don’t even know what Silva was trying to do, but today people are acting like he actually had a brilliant strategy just because the tone of the blog changed. I think professional fighters should exhibit a quality of gameness that most Counter strikers don’t display. All these people that are saying “do you want to get hit in the head?” just don’t understand the concept of being a game fighter in my opinion. They are in a prize fight, not defending themselves in an unwanted street fight.
If the object is to win the fight(and it better be) then letting the other guy hit you in the head might not be the best strategy to start off with. I don’t think there can be too much arguement over whether it was a great fight or not(it wasn’t) but that doesn’t mean that either guy was goofing off or sandbagging during the fight either. It’s one thing to say that Silva didn’t seem to have a good night it’s another thing entirely to accuse him of disrespect or being timid or having a “temper tantrum” in the cage. Sometimes fights just aren’t good but by what actually matters in any sport Silva was winning that fight. Sometimes fans get caught up more in what they want and expect and lose site of the fact that the object of all professional sports is to win by any legal means neccessary(even if it is boring). In what really looked to be a sub-par performace from Silva he was still well ahead in that fight and never seemed to be anywhere close to in trouble.
I don’t agree with the temper trantrum analogy, but I do believe he was goofing around and being disrespectful. I heard a comment where Silva blamed the cut from 230 to 205 and then to 185 as the reason for his performance. But I can’t buy that he was weak. Vera looked like he was weak from cutting weight when he fought Andy Reese. And Vera wasn’t hopping around and dropping his hands like Silva. In the first round when Silva was dropping his hand, turning his lead shoulder and pacing left and right, it looked like he was almost saying he was turning his back on Cote. No matter what, it was a WEIRD fight, I think we all can agree on that. And it is nice to discuss some issues with fans as passionate as myself.
SHE SHOULD LOSE HER JOB THAT WASN'T FAIR REVIEW
FRIST WHO THE HELL IS MAGGIE DAMN PPL TALKING ABOUT MMA WHERE WERE THEY BEFORE TUF NO WHERE THATS WERE I LIKE THE FREE FIGHTS NOT BUT SHIT EVERYONE TALKING ABOUT SHIT THAT THEY HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE HELL THERE SAYING HOW DO YOU SAY A GUY IS BEING TOYED/DOMINATING WHEN HE WAS PACKING UP AND RUNNING AROUND WITH COTE TAKING THE CENTER AND PRESSING THE FIGHT I THINK THIS WOMAN NEEDS TO BE FIRED THIS IS NOT NEW THIS IS TOTAL ONE SIDED B.S. ITS LIKE SAYING THAT UFC IS THE BIGGEST AND BEST COMPANY EVER WITCH ITS NOT BECAUSE LETS FACE IT WHEN PRIDE WAS AT TOP UFC WAS WHILE LETS JUST SAY WEC LEVEL YOU KNOW AAA. PRIDE HAD 90,000 FANS IN THE AREA I KNOW UFC IS NO WHERE NEAR THAT PACKED SO YEA THIS LADIE IS NOT A REAL REPORTER AT ALL SMACK N YA FACE
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