Josh Koscheck Wants Both Thiago Alves and Yoshiyuki Yoshida

by themachiavellian on Oct 17, 2008 8:56 PM EDT Comment 15 comments

Frontpaged by Kid Nate.

Five Ounces of Pain broke the insanely stupid idea:

During a conference call to promote UFC 90, Josh Koscheck confirmed that he plans to fight twice in the next sixty days. First, Koscheck takes on Thiago Alves in the co-main event on October 25th. Then, If Koscheck comes out unscathed, he will have a six week turn around to prepare for Yoshiyuki Yoshida on December 10.

So Alves punished both Hughes and Parisyan, and someone who's strategy consists of almost exclusively takedowns plans to remain unscathed enough for a bout against a tough judoka (a rarity, and therefore hard to train for)? Koscheck has always overestimated his abilities (think "I'll win because GSP can't handle wrestlers", or "Nineteen and Onnnnnne!"), but this is a bit much.

Alves is massive, as noted by his difficulties in making weight. I suspect he can muscle Kos around like he did Hughes. He also brutally finished his last five opponents, while Koscheck couldn't stop an exsanguinated Chris Lytle.

Obviously I don't see Koscheck beating Alves, but if he does, I don't see him being in any condition to fight only 1-2 months later. Alves roughed up Jon Fitch and pummeled Spencer Fisher before losing those two fights, and he should have beaten Fisher before he got careless. Koscheck should only think about Alves right now; if he can fight both, good for him, but he could be planning too much.

Good luck, Josh - you might get what you're asking for...

Will this be the fighter to stop the rise of "The Pitbull"?

EDIT: After reading the comments then re-reading my post, I realized how inappropriate it was. My initial point, which was quickly dropped, was that Alves was too tough for Koscheck to plan to fight again so soon against another tough opponent. If he can pull it off, more power to him. Mea culpa.

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Alves fan much? I don’t get whether this is criticism of Kos’ plan to fight two fight or a declaration that Alves is going to smash him. I really dislike arguments in favour of fighters that say “he was winning before he lost”. It’s MMA for a reason. Granted, the fights against Fitch and Fisher were a while ago, but you have to think that Kos has a huge wrestling advantage and is going to use it to his utmost ability to control the fight. Alves does not seem to like the fight going to the mat. It’s def going to be a good one.

by LiuLang on Oct 17, 2008 10:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Alves is OK, but I just think Koscheck is overextending himself (you are right, though, that I was initially unclear and far too biased – I don’t think Alves will smash Koscheck, but he will hurt the guy.) I think the “winning before he lost” argument is valid in certain circumstances – e.g. Koscheck completely controlled Drew Fickett, only for Fickett to pull out a choke in the last minute of the fight. In that instance, Fickett deserved the win because Kos tapped, but he hardly had a impressive showing.

Kos has one of the best wrestling games out there, and he will definitely try to outwork Alves, but I think Alves’s knees could stop a few takedowns, and a Koscheck without takedowns is lost. If Kos manages to fight both guys, I will be impressed, I just think it’s unreasonable to be planning past such a tough fight.

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Oct 17, 2008 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I do admit, I find it unlikely that he’ll fight in both matches. Unless he plans to lay on Alves for three rounds, but hey, Kos is used to the boos. If Alves scores another knee KO from someone shooting in on him, well, people need to start watching tapes. You do make a good point though, as I don’t really think Kos is a body lock, take down kinda guy. Usually comes in for those big shots. Who knows, we’ll see what his game plan will be soon enough.

by LiuLang on Oct 17, 2008 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

bonus points for use of the word "exsanguinated"

"It's like a flying knuckle sandwich." --Rogan
"And many men have eaten it." -- Goldy

by thetakeover on Oct 17, 2008 11:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Thanks - I figured it's better than the "stuck pig" metaphor

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Oct 17, 2008 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

This article only seems to exist to bash koscheck. If he thinks he can do it, I can’t see the wrong in it. He isn’t that cocky after all, maybe he think he made enough progress in his game to be the top guy. We can blame people to have (realistic but hard to accomplish) ambitions.

by spectaa on Oct 17, 2008 11:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Kos can do it.

But I doubt it. I always figured he’d lose both match ups.

by pud333 on Oct 17, 2008 11:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I find the tone of this article puzzling. For instance “He also brutally finished his last five opponents, while Koscheck couldn’t stop an exsanguinated Chris Lytle.”

Alves fought Lytle less than a year ago and won due to a cut, in what was a fairly even fight. Koscheck brutalized Lytle for three rounds.

by Michaelthebox on Oct 18, 2008 12:37 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Lytle was clearly winning the fight v. Alves.

by szucconi on Oct 18, 2008 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I had it one round to one.

by Michaelthebox on Oct 18, 2008 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I didn’t score rounds, I was live in the arena and everyone had the impression Lytle was clearly winning. I think they both pretty much agreed that a rematch should take place. I guess the brass had other ideas.

by szucconi on Oct 18, 2008 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, I crapped out on this post.

I forgot how close the Alves/Lytle fight was…dammit I need an editor…or a brain check…

Can I just recant this, except for my ultimate prediction of Alves winning?

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Oct 18, 2008 12:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I expect Kos to win this fight, for what its worth. He probably won’t be able to fight Yoshida, but its not a completely insane thing to say.

by Michaelthebox on Oct 18, 2008 12:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

People shouldn't use MMA math on young fighters...

Alves has greatly improved. So using fights from last year to determine his ability today is foolish.

On the other hand, Koscheck has greatly improved. However, only one is exciting and the other is still a wet blanket.

by cyph on Oct 18, 2008 10:47 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Kinda unfair to bash Koscheck for not finishing Lytle considering no one has ever done it [cuts don’t count]. Koscheck has some of the best wrestling in MMA and has developed very good striking.. Koscheck will succeed on the grund because unlike Matt Hughes, he has good enough striking to be able to use it to set up his takedowns. All Hughes could do was shoot from the outside and hope he could land the takedown.

And on a side note: Yoshida is still unproven IMO; beating War Machine is not all that impressive. He has a ton of potiental, but a fight with hte judoka would be a step down for Koscheck when he could easily get a title shot for beating Alves.

by Zack Gobie on Oct 18, 2008 11:29 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs